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CFOP-Breaker? Mehta method

Andreas5204

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Joined
Jul 29, 2020
Messages
11
im curious, its sub-40 movecount?? Thats even lower than roux and zz, and is it still as/better than CFOP??? the ZB equivalent of metha might be one of the most fastest and/or efficient methods for speedsolving.
HARCS says that Mehta-TDR (the new name of Meta-Mehta) is around 43 moves on average. You're right, it's a really promising top speedsolving method.
 

Andreas5204

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Joined
Jul 29, 2020
Messages
11
Here is a link to a Reddit post about Mehta. It offers a full explanation, example solve, and links to helpful resources.
The response to that post was overwhelmingly (and unexpectedly) positive, and we had several new additions to our Discord server within the first day after posting.
 

Devagio

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Joined
Apr 21, 2020
Messages
220
im curious, its sub-40 movecount?? Thats even lower than roux and zz, and is it still as/better than CFOP??? the ZB equivalent of metha might be one of the most fastest and/or efficient methods for speedsolving.
HARCS with optimal TDR and ZBLL gives it 39.xy, and with the ZBLL alg-list and RUDS TDR gives around 43. Since a big chunk of this number is algs, real-life movecount would be very-close to 43, maybe even better if some advanced EOLedge is done. One of the most efficient, certainly. Fastest, I do put my bets on it and hope so but it's too soon to tell.
is there a reconstruction of the 27 move solve? I wanna see it[/spoiler]
I didn't save the simulation, but I ran the simulation again and again got (2) 27 move solutions. Remember, this is with a constrained version of the method (i.e. less efficient).
Here are the two solutions:

D2 B R' D B' R2 D , U R2 u R E2 R' u , U F R F' U R' , U2 L' U R2 U' R2 L , , ,

U2 R B L' F' D2 , E R' E2 R' u' , F R' F' R , U2 R U R2 U2 R2 U R' U2 R' U' R , , ,

Both were 6CP-skip and L5EP-skip.

EDIT: Ran a 200k solve simulation of the constrained version again, and got a 20-mover. EOLE-skip, 6CO-skip and L5EP-skip.
D L2 B' D F D2 L' B , U R' U E R u2 R u' , , , U2 R2 U' R2 , ,
 
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Devagio

Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2020
Messages
220
I tried making a beginners' version tutorial. It's not great quality, but it's well explained and in depth.


Here is an overview of all variations of the method for 2H 3x3x3 after EO-ledge.

 
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ZF slow

Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2018
Messages
56
Location
My basement
Mehta-TDR (Meta-mehta) feels like one of those methods that will be hyped up before dying after nobody learns the algs, like ZB or ZZ-CT. Still excited to see it in practice though. Mehta and the variants are incredibly promising.
 

Jam88

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Mar 23, 2020
Messages
376
Location
inside a cube
YouTube
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I tried making a beginners' version tutorial. It's not great quality, but it's well explained and in depth.


Here is an overview of all variations of the method for 2H 3x3x3 after EO-ledge.

Where is the non- beginners method tutorial?
Because it seems interesting, but I don't understand the writing.
 

Andreas5204

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Joined
Jul 29, 2020
Messages
11
Mehta-TDR (Meta-mehta) feels like one of those methods that will be hyped up before dying after nobody learns the algs, like ZB or ZZ-CT. Still excited to see it in practice though. Mehta and the variants are incredibly promising.
This may be the case, and of course it's too early to tell; but I don't think ZZ-CT is a fair comparison, since the algs are generally considered to be bad.
We'll be genning the TDR algs later this week. Once that's done, it'll be easier to compare Mehta-TDR and ZB.
 

Andreas5204

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2020
Messages
11
Some news from the Mehta server:
1. One of our members got an 8 second single, the fastest with Mehta so far, using...the beginner's method. This, we feel, is a really good indication that this method has a lot of potential.
2. We've been developing the TDR algs, with tons of help from @trangium. Once we have finalized a few things, we'll be able to make a proper Mehta-TDR to ZB comparison.
3. We have had lots of new members join our server in the past week, which is also really encouraging.
 

DNF_Cuber

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Nov 14, 2020
Messages
297
Location
hiding... you'll soon know where.
this method could be used for speed fmc or something. @Cubing Forever what do you think?
mentioning so he could see this.
Spoiler:The popularity of speed FMC
It is barely even a weekly comp event
EDIT: I think this is a good speedsolving method but speed FMC isn't a worthwhile use
 
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LukasCubes

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Aug 10, 2020
Messages
325
Location
West Virginia
Can you do a solve simulation with a few thousand mehta TDR solves and give me the reconscruction of the lowest movecount? Also how do you do solve simulations?
 

Andreas5204

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2020
Messages
11
HARCS doesn't give individual reconstructions, just numbers.
HARCS give Mehta-TDR an average movecount of around 43, but that number is actually lower, because HARCS ran the simulations on fixed-FB and belt. A color neutral solver could realistically expect a lower movecount. @Devagio can post the HARCS stats.
 
Joined
Aug 30, 2020
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On a long train journey, Smashin' PBs one a stop
this method could be used for speed fmc or something. @Cubing Forever what do you think?
mentioning so he could see this.
Yeah good point bc speed FMC doesn't allow the time to think a lot so this might be useful.
But anyone using this for normal FMC can achieve sub 30 consistently.
other than that, this could be a very fast method if used with full ZBLL
maybe this could beat CFOP and Roux in the near future.
 

Devagio

Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2020
Messages
220
HARCS doesn't give individual reconstructions, just numbers.
HARCS give Mehta-TDR an average movecount of around 43, but that number is actually lower, because HARCS ran the simulations on fixed-FB and belt. A color neutral solver could realistically expect a lower movecount. @Devagio can post the HARCS stats.
Actually HARCS can export reconstructions.


Can you do a solve simulation with a few thousand mehta TDR solves and give me the reconscruction of the lowest movecount? Also how do you do solve simulations?
I've attached a reconstruction of 100 solves. These wouldn't be great solves to emulate because HARCS doesn't utilise the D offset, has a single FB, and a fixed belt, leading to 3-4 extra moves on average. But you should get an idea.
 

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