Best of Petrus and Fridrich?

cubetimer

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As mentioned in a previous post, I've been teetering between Petrus and Fridrich lately, but that's really not the subject of this post. I recently started using Petrus for F2L only, then using Fridrich to do OLL and PLL. The nice part is, because Fridrich already solves the top cross, there's only 7 OLL moves to memorize.

While this is convenient for memorization, I can't help but wonder if I'm missing something. Is there a significant benefit to doing one of the two methods in their pure form, or does it really not matter?
 
Most people who use petrus, use either just OLL/PLL, or COLL/EPLL. If you learn the COLLs, then you can just have an easy PLL case with only edges to permute. Petrus can be fast, as Anthony Hsu won kearny today with a 14.xx average.
 
I suggest learning both - then you can decide which is better! However, I am leaning towards fridrich, because it is a lot more automatic, and the last layer is a lot quicker. However, I do suggest learning COLL, it can come in really handy.
 
The nice part is, because Fridrich already solves the top cross, there's only 7 OLL moves to memorize.
s/Fridrich/Petrus/

Is there a significant benefit to doing one of the two methods in their pure form, or does it really not matter?
There isn't really such thing as "pure Petrus LL". There are several good ways to solve it, and it doesn't really matter which one(s) you use. F2L is the key.

I am leaning towards fridrich, because it is a lot more automatic, and the last layer is a lot quicker.
How could Fridrich LL possibly be faster than Petrus LL? Why would skipping EO slow you down?
 
The nice part is, because Fridrich already solves the top cross, there's only 7 OLL moves to memorize.
s/Fridrich/Petrus/

Is there a significant benefit to doing one of the two methods in their pure form, or does it really not matter?
There isn't really such thing as "pure Petrus LL". There are several good ways to solve it, and it doesn't really matter which one(s) you use. F2L is the key.

I am leaning towards fridrich, because it is a lot more automatic, and the last layer is a lot quicker.
How could Fridrich LL possibly be faster than Petrus LL? Why would skipping EO slow you down?

Isn't petrus LL 3 looks?
 
Isn't petrus LL 3 looks?

lol

I will paste my analysis of Fridrich and Petrus:

Okay, here is my "extensive" analysis of the two methods in terms of F2L. LL is pretty much all in the same direction. Petrus has the upper hand, on that one, though.

Step 1: Cross vs. 2x2x2

2x2x2 has more freedom, seeing as you have 8 options over 6 (but Fridrich users generally aren't color-neutral).

Cross generally has easier-to-see patterns, making it more accessible to beginners.

In terms of move count, we're about the same: 5-7 moves (correct me if I'm wrong).

Step 2-3: 2x2x3 + Bad Edges vs. CE Pair 1-2

Technically, CE pairs have more freedom in terms of choices, but Petrus also has three faces free for turning.

CE Pairs all have generally the same finger tricks, making them easy to pick up fast.

Once again, doing the 2x2x3 extension is harder to see [psuedo]-optimal solutions. Also, watching Johannes's cube simulator fastest solve seems to indicate a slight pause between 2x2x2 and 2x2x3. This, however, is compensated for the fact that the 2x2x3 phase with bad edges is on average shorter (in move count) than doing two CE pairs.

Step 4[-5]: Rest of the F2L

Petrus seems to have the upper-hand here. It can constantly use RU, while Fridrich may take a couple extra faces. The cases are pretty much the same between the two methods.

From this, I argue that the two methods are pretty much balanced in terms of solving time. However, over the past couple of years, Fridrich has enjoyed greater popularity, hence more work has been done on it. In the long run (theoretically speaking), I think that which method is "faster" just depends on the specific scrambles and the cubers themselves. In the words of Jessica Fridrich, "we should not be comparing systems but cubists."
 
Ok, I'm going to voice my opinion on this one, but I know somebody out there is going to disagree with me.

When you learn a method, you are learning it for the F2L. If you average sub 20 with a Fridrich F2L but a 3 look LL (I used to) does that mean that you're not using Fridrich?

Most Petrus users I know solve the F2L using Petrus, and then the LL using OLL/PLL. Some people like Johannes use a bunch of amazing techniques that get them one look last layers. Some people use COLL/ELL.

I use a Petrus F2L with a OLL/PLL last layer. Does that mean that I'm not using Petrus? The method lies in the F2L, because it is the longest part of the solve. Basically, you are learning two different methods at the same time. One main method for the F2L, and another for the LL.


Sorry, I just get frustrated when people seem to think that Petrus has to use a 3 look LL. On his site somewhere he even says he is only showing a beginner's way of doing it, and he also says he uses COLL/ELL. I guess that means Petrus doesn't even use Petrus, eh? :p
 
Speedy, this actually helps me quite a bit. I suspected the truth was exactly as you said it, and I think you're right. Basically the method you use for F2L and LL are two totally different things.

One thing I will say, and I've heard echoed by others, is that the more methods I learn the better I get at all of them. It gives me a better all around understanding of how the cube actually moves. I recently learned the Heise method and, while I'm VERY slow with it right now, it's helped me understand a lot of things that make what I already knew make so much more sense.

SO help me out here: is COLL simultaneously orienting AND permuting corners? I'd be interested in where I can find out more about this. Since I learned Petrus first I'm very familiar with PLL cases involving edges only and might find it faster to treat the corners as a single move on their own...
 
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