Avoiding G perms?

[Lazy Einstein]

I seriously get G's 8/10 solves. I know full PLL/OLL so I can solve them but I hate them. Any suggestions on avoiding them?

I figured I should try and learn ZBLL or Winter Variations or maybe learn to insert F2L pairs differently to orient edges. Maybe learn ZZ =P

Does any of you control your LL to avoid them?

 

[EMI]

Learn to love them This is done by learning different algs / executions for the same cases.
R2 Uw' R U' R U R' Uw R2 Fw R' Fw'
= R2 Uw' R U' R U R' Uw R2 y R U' R'
= y2 R2 F2 R U2 R U2 R' F R U R' U' R' F R2
etc.

 

[Stefan]

I seriously get G's 8/10 solves.

No you don't.

 

[Lazy Einstein]

No you don't.

Sorry if the sarcasm wasn't obvious. I don't unfortunately have the exact numbers on how many times I encounter G perms but it happens a lot. =P
anyway, back to the topic...

Learn to love them This is done by learning different algs / executions for the same cases.
R2 Uw' R U' R U R' Uw R2 Fw R' Fw'
= R2 Uw' R U' R U R' Uw R2 y R U' R'
= y2 R2 F2 R U2 R U2 R' F R U R' U' R' F R2
etc.

I have been learning them from the y2 position of my original algs because I get them so much.
Look at this sexy alteration of the G(d) I ninja'd from one of Feliks solves. y2 L U r' U2' x D' R U' R' U R' u R2

 

[TDM]

I figured I should try and learn ZBLL or Winter Variations or maybe learn to insert F2L pairs differently to orient edges. Maybe learn ZZ =P

Does any of you control your LL to avoid them?

Seeing as G perms are part of ZBLL, and WV, F2LEO and EOF2L don't affect PLL in any way, I can't see how any of those will help with your apparently 80% chance of getting G perms.

 

[Ronxu]

OLLCP

 

[Lazy Einstein]

Seeing as G perms are part of ZBLL, and WV, F2LEO and EOF2L don't affect PLL in any way, I can't see how any of those will help with your apparently 80% chance of getting G perms.

Yeah I don't really know. I thought ZBLL gave you PLL skips. As for the others, I know little to nothing about them. I thought I read something about the ability to determine the PLL you get through how you solved. That is why I made this thread. I was hoping someone with more knowledge could send me in the right direction if this were indeed true.

 

[Lazy Einstein]

OLLCP

Oh cool. Sarah's site seems to have a good number of cases too. I'll take a look. http://sarah.cubing.net/3x3x3/ocllcp

 

[kcl]

Oh cool. Sarah's site seems to have a good number of cases too. I'll take a look. http://sarah.cubing.net/3x3x3/ocllcp

I would say OLLCP is good, but having good G perms is critical. I can sub 1 most of mine, and I don't hate them anymore.

 

[Kirjava]

"Not doing OLL/PLL"

 

[TDM]

Yeah I don't really know. I thought ZBLL gave you PLL skips. As for the others, I know little to nothing about them. I thought I read something about the ability to determine the PLL you get through how you solved. That is why I made this thread. I was hoping someone with more knowledge could send me in the right direction if this were indeed true.

ZBLL can give you PLL skips, but you need the edges to be oriented. You also have the chance that the corners will already be oriented, giving you a PLL, which could be a G perm. How you do F2L has no effect on PLL, unless you use a method such as ZZ-d, which permuted the corners. If you do CPF2L, you have to ensure you also either orient edges before doing it, or orient them with R, r, U, u and S moves only.

Oh cool. Sarah's site seems to have a good number of cases too. I'll take a look. http://sarah.cubing.net/3x3x3/ocllcp

That's not OLLCP, that's COLL. Again, you need all edges to be oriented to use this... but you still have the chance that all corners will be oriented which leaves you with a PLL, which could be a G perm. OLLCP is a huge number of algs to learn, and you have to learn a decent number for it to be useful in many solves.

I would say OLLCP is good, but having good G perms is critical. I can sub 1 most of mine, and I don't hate them anymore.

Thisthisthis. I used to hate G perms, but then I learned good ones, and I no longer hate two of them. Because avoiding them is so difficult, it's much easier to simply get used to them and do something to make them not as bad.

E: or what Kir said

 

[Lazy Einstein]

"Not doing OLL/PLL"

No OLL/PLL? Different method?

 

[ChickenWrap]

No OLL/PLL? Different method?

CLL/ELL would work!

 

[Stefan]

Sorry if the sarcasm wasn't obvious.

I don't see how that could possibly qualify as "sarcasm".

 

[Lazy Einstein]

ZBLL can give you PLL skips, but you need the edges to be oriented. You also have the chance that the corners will already be oriented, giving you a PLL, which could be a G perm. How you do F2L has no effect on PLL, unless you use a method such as ZZ-d, which permuted the corners. If you do CPF2L, you have to ensure you also either orient edges before doing it, or orient them with R, r, U, u and S moves only.

That's not OLLCP, that's COLL. Again, you need all edges to be oriented to use this... but you still have the chance that all corners will be oriented which leaves you with a PLL, which could be a G perm. OLLCP is a huge number of algs to learn, and you have to learn a decent number for it to be useful in many solves.

Thisthisthis. I used to hate G perms, but then I learned good ones, and I no longer hate two of them. Because avoiding them is so difficult, it's much easier to simply get used to them and do something to make them not as bad.

E: or what Kir said

I should probably drill my PLL Alg's anyway. I am only able to sub 1 my H perm and the rest are 2ish sec averages.

 

[uberCuber]

I should probably drill my PLL Alg's anyway. I am only able to sub 1 my H perm and the rest are 2ish sec averages.

Omg why do new people turn so fast, I still have difficulty sub-1'ing H perms.

 

[Lazy Einstein]

Omg why do new people turn so fast, I still have difficulty sub-1'ing H perms.

It is not my average H perm time. It is just the only one I have got sub-1 on.

I like to think I have fast hands anyway. I have been speed typing for a few years too and am at 100 wpm ave. Sure that helps quite a bit for being fast on the cube while being new.

 

[TDM]

No OLL/PLL? Different method?

CFCE (probably not good), Roux (good), ZZ with COLL (although there's still a chance of G perms) etc.

I should probably drill my PLL Alg's anyway. I am only able to sub 1 my H perm and the rest are 2ish sec averages.

Find ones you like, then drill them. Otherwise you'll spend a lot of time trying to get faster at algs you don't end up using.

Omg why do new people turn so fast, I still have difficulty sub-1'ing H perms.

I can't sub-1 H perm... it's one of my least favourite PLLs. I hate all CPLLs.

 

[Lazy Einstein]

Find ones you like, then drill them. Otherwise you'll spend a lot of time trying to get faster at algs you don't end up using.

I can't sub-1 H perm... it's one of my least favourite PLLs. I hate all CPLLs.

I have been finding algs I like. I totally understand what you mean there.

And hate H-perms?! So fast though. =P

I grip with my left ring and left pinky on back with left thumb on front so left index and middle can double flick U2. My right hand does M2' with right middle and ring finger. Right Index and right thumb grip.

So M2' U' M2' U2' M2' U' M2' acts like M' U' M' U' M' U' M' because all the M2 U2 are double flicked as one shot. Love it! Feels so natural.

 

[TDM]

I have been finding algs I like. I totally understand what you mean there.

And hate H-perms?! So fast though. =P

I grip with my left ring and left pinky on back with left thumb on front so left index and middle can double flick U2. My right hand does M2' with right middle and ring finger. Right Index and right thumb grip.

So M2' U' M2' U2' M2' U' M2' acts like M' U' M' U' M' U' M' because all the M2 U2 are double flicked as one shot. Love it! Feels so natural.

I've done something bad, and that's getting used to bad fingertricks. I execute my M2s as R' [r M'], doing the last two moves simultaneously. It's faster for the MU U perms, especially Ua (M2 U M U2 M' U M2), but it sucks for H and Z perms. I know double flicking should be faster, but I have to regrip, which takes time, then get lots of lockups. My Z perms used to be my favourite PLL by far, and I could get a very high TPS on them for my speed at the time. I can't any more. I try to execute it how you do though... I just suck at it that way. Both ways actually