Older cubers discussions

[cowabunga]

How is movecount debatable?
I just wanted to know if he uses fewer moves CN.

 

[MarcelP]

I love to talk about this topic. The Color neutral thread seems almost dead anyway. I think the move count for me on white and CN are about the same. I do the same F2L techniques. The only thing is that on white solves I do not have to think about which edge goes with which corner. So I can use that time to look for the next pair while solving the current. I can not do that on CN solves. I find the corner and then have to reconstruct the egde colors from there. It seems to go better and better with practice but it is still far from white solves. Yesterday I did only white cross solves and did nothing but Lookahead training. So looking for the next pair almost before solving the current. It kind of affected my CN solving today In a good way..
You are right about switching to Cn if it helps only just two moves or 1 or 2 seconds on an easy cross. What is the point? I think it is a lot of investment for just that small achievement. However, if I look at the true color neutral guys, these are the ones that started out color neutral from the beginning. And these are the people that will get world records. So being CN is a good thing. If you are a very dominant color and solved a million times on that one, I think it is not worth the effert to switch.

I have a very dominant white cross (since I can not even get same averages with yellow), but I find it just big fun to switch. I am not sure if I ever will be CN. At least I will have seriously tried.

 

[uvafan]

How is movecount debatable?
I just wanted to know if he uses fewer moves CN.

I was talking about the point you brought up in your last sentence, which brought up whether or not it was worth it to switch to CN.

 

[sneaklyfox]

Actually I think benefits of being CN are hardly the one move that you save in the cross. If that were the case, it certainly would not be worth going through all the trouble to switch. It's more because you can look ahead further if you happen to have an easy cross and later when you learn advanced techniques like X-cross for example, you'll be able to do it much more often with 6 choices than with just 1 choice. Sometimes I wonder though how much inspection time it costs to decide on a good cross and plan it out? Also, one cross may look a little easier but another one may actually be better? I remember watching some videos on youtube of Feliks doing some solves in competition. Sometimes after he plans his cross with his chosen colour he's getting ready to start the timer and meanwhile he's shaking his head. I wonder if it's because he wish he chose a different colour because the one he chose wasn't as good as he thought it would be.

 

[Kattenvriendin]

My experience on being color neutral doesn't affect the inserting of F2L pairs. Matching them up, yes, but inserting is as fast as always.

 

[MarcelP]

Sometimes I wonder though how much inspection time it costs to decide on a good cross and plan it out?

Actually this is for me the easiest part now. In the beginning of switching to CN I found it very hard to decide what cross color to pick. Now I scan the cube in like 2 - 4 seconds and know immediatly when color to choose. Then I start thinking out the cross and have about 10 seconds left of inspection time to do so. In fact I have found my self doing Ao12 white solves 'only' and on accident do cross on any other color than white. LOL

 

[cowabunga]

Maybe I will give CN another try.
It is fun

 

[MarcelP]

Today I did an Ao50 COLOR NEUTRAL

I came close with an Ao12 PB. I looked in my archives and I was only sub 31 with Ao50 on white cross just 6 weeks ago.. So, I guess I will stay with color neutral now. It will be just a matter of weeks when I will surpass my current PBs. I am not in a hurry or training for a competition so no worries there..

Today is a great day!

 

[Kattenvriendin]

Very well done!!

 

[ThomasJE]

Today I did an Ao50 COLOR NEUTRAL

I came close with an Ao12 PB. I looked in my archives and I was only sub 31 with Ao50 on white cross just 6 weeks ago.. So, I guess I will stay with color neutral now. It will be just a matter of weeks when I will surpass my current PBs. I am not in a hurry or training for a competition so no worries there..

Today is a great day!

Nice! Good single at the end too.

Also, if you spell color the English way (colour), you can get all six colours in the word.

 

[sneaklyfox]

Nice, Marcel. What colour was the 20.24?

 

[MarcelP]

Very well done!!

Thanks. Are you finished with red yet?

Nice! Good single at the end too.

Also, if you spell color the English way (colour), you can get all six colours in the word.

Is color without the u a good word? I always thought it was some kind of Canadian spelling with the u.

Nice, Marcel. What colour was the 20.24?

The last one was a white cross.. The scramble is on a different computer. I will post it later. I had a a 21 also in there on white. I think I did about 4 or 5 white crosses in these 50. My best none white was a 25 on orange..

 

[moralsh]

Nice, Marcel. What colour was the 20.24?

I was going to bet on white because the scramble gives an easy white cross, but that's just the next scramble, isn't it?

 

[Kattenvriendin]

Thanks. Are you finished with red yet?

Yes in fact. Almost hit sub50 AO12 yesterday when I timed myself, so.. soon enough

 

[uvafan]

Thanks. Are you finished with red yet?



Is color without the u a good word? I always thought it was some kind of Canadian spelling with the u.

Yeah, it's the British spelling. I guess Canadians use it also. People in the U.S. spell it color, I'm not really sure which other countries spell it color and which colour.

 

[Kattenvriendin]

Australia would be my guess

 

[MarcelP]

First solve of today


1. 23.94 F2 L2 U2 L2 D' L2 F2 D' B2 R' F2 U F2 L' B' U2 R B' R D

Cross on orange..
I am soooo going to stick with color neutral

EDIT1: First 5..
Best average of 5: 28.62
1-5 - (23.94) (32.96) 29.13 28.62 28.12

EDIT2: Oh wow sub 30 on the first 12. Only one white cross (the 25.44)
Best average of 12: 29.44
1-12 - (23.94) 32.96 29.13 28.62 28.12 32.40 28.55 25.44 30.44 29.62 29.07 (34.13)

EDIT3: I managed to squeeze a better Ao5 and Ao12 out there in a total A050:

Mean: 30.36
Average: 30.40
Best time: 21.56
Median: 29.79
Worst time: 37.28
Standard deviation: 3.68

Best average of 5: 27.89
32-36 - (21.56) 27.00 28.24 (36.30) 28.44

Best average of 12: 29.13
32-43 - (21.56) 27.00 28.24 36.30 28.44 (36.43) 27.62 29.95 25.10 28.84 28.47 31.32

 

[mark49152]

Hi Marcel - you probably have seen this already, but might find it interesting: http://www.cubezone.be/crossstudy.html

 

[MarcelP]

Hi Marcel - you probably have seen this already, but might find it interesting: http://www.cubezone.be/crossstudy.html

No, that is indeed interesting. I already notice that I find much more easy crosses. I am bad at crosses and I think my times on an easy (none white) cross is better than my time on a hard white cross. Cool webiste btw. His name sounds Dutch.

 

[mark49152]

No, that is indeed interesting. I already notice that I find much more easy crosses. I am bad at crosses and I think my times on an easy (none white) cross is better than my time on a hard white cross. Cool webiste btw. His name sounds Dutch.

Yeah my crosses suck too. My best Ao12 for cross only is 8.15. I thought it was interesting to see the expected difference in move count for CN and dual. I'm trying to decide whether to master cross planning based on one colour so that I have smooth turning and no pauses even when 8 moves are needed, or whether to compromise on planning but be able to do it for all colours.

WHat is your motive for training CN? To reduce overall move count, or because you find planning the harder crosses difficult? I find I am struggling to plan past about 4-5 moves because I lose track of where the other edges will end up.