Algorithms For F2L

[dabest2500]

Is it quicker to do F2L intuitively or use algorithms.
Also, is it faster to use the two algorithms from the beginner's method in Step 3 to solve an edge if a corner is already inserted or to take out the corner and match it up with the edge?
Thanks.

 

[freshcuber]

Intuitive is faster to learn and better for your knowledge of how pieces move. For the corner in correctly and edge out that's still what I do. Check of badmephisto for tutorials.

 

[dabest2500]

I already know F2L, and badmephisto is who I learnt it from, I'm simply looking to improve it.
Cross and F2L is 12-16 seconds if that helps in the answering of my question.
"For the corner in correctly and edge out that's still what I do."

What do you mean? Intuitive or algorithm?

 

[RTh]

I would recommend looking for algorithms only for those cases which you find hard to solve. There are some sites online where you can find general F2L algorithms, and also sites where you can create your own algs for certain cases.

Google is your friend in this matter.

Which is quicker I cannot tell, I think intuitive + some algs is the best.

 

[freshcuber]

If the corner is in the slot correctly oriented I just line up the edge like in the begginners method and then I take out the corner and insert it just like I would with the beginners method.

IF you already know F2L then just keep practicing it. Erik Akkersdijk has a video of F2L tricks that's pretty good. So does the Westonian.

 

[dabest2500]

What would a good F2L and Cross time be for sub 20?

 

[freshcuber]

12 or less for cross+F2L and then an 8 second LL. Neither of which are very fast. To get better at F2L practice it. Hut work smarter, not harder. For LL just learn OLL and PLL and as long as your recognition doesn't suck you can easily sub-5 LL

 

[dabest2500]

Okay, and that's all I need to know.
Thanks.

 

[MichaelP.]

Okay, and that's all I need to know.
Thanks.

Have you learned nothing from the previous thread you made? Use the one answer question thread.

 

[maggot]

For taking out a corner when its already inserted, its hard to explain, but there is a easy trick if your edge is oriented properly. Place a correctly oriented edge on the R side, sexy to pull out the corner and push the U' a little bit further to perform a U2 and RUR' to make the pair, U2 RU'R'. so the "alg" is R U R' U2' (when you perform the sexy move your left hand index finger is on the front left. push your index finger all the way to the front right) R U R' U2 R U' R'. If the edge is unoriented properly, then do almost the same thing with the sexy U2 thing, R U' R' U cube rotate and L' U' L to insert. so the alg is R U R' U2 R U' R' U y L' U' L. I think its good to know the good case, but the bad case I perform as the beginner method where I pull the corner out and pair it by flipping the corner onto the edge and cube rotating to insert. it all depends on if i recognize that the corner is properly oriented or not, its habit to pull out corners from the slot, regardless of wether i can make an easy pair or not.

Also, again... stop making threads

 

[RubikZz]

I know F2L but what is Intuitive?

 

[collinbxyz]

I know F2L but what is Intuitive?

No algorithms.

 

[Juju]

I just don't get it. If you already have a 12-16 second cross+F2L, why are you asking such questions? Most people take a long time and develop quite a good understanding of F2L by the time they are at such low times.

 

[dabest2500]

I just don't get it. If you already have a 12-16 second cross+F2L, why are you asking such questions? Most people take a long time and develop quite a good understanding of F2L by the time they are at such low times.

Because there is obviously room for improvement.

 

[Meisen]

My personal belief is that IF you have the time and dedication to memorize all the algorithms for f2l, then go ahead and do it. I did, and it worked for me. The upside of learning it that way is that you will not have to relearn any F2L cases later on (If your source is good). The only downside i see in this approach is that it's time costly. On the other hand the end result is worth it, in my opinion.

 

[Selkie]

I see a few advantages to intuitive as the main basis for F2L. Though I have only been cubing again for two months so others may have more informed advice:-

All algorithms are based on being performed on the 4th slot with no other open slots. Therefore most will have more optimal moves with more open slots.

Intuitive gives a lot of insight into the mechanics of the cube. This can even assist with memorising and understanding OLL algorithms since most OLLs are essentially taking out slots and replacing them. Common triggers such as RUR'U', RUR'U, R'FRF', RU2R are just manipulating a slot. Sune and AntiSune and taking out a pair and putting them back in in a different way. Intuitive helps you understand this.

Intutive lends itself better to inserting pairs in any slot rather than the bias with algorithms towards FR pair.

Multislotting or influencing next pair is based on type of insertion of current one and will be easier to grasp the concept, if you choose to try it, it you solve intuitively.

As I said others may have more informed advise but personally I learned intuitively and have supported this with algorythms for some of the more awkward cases. But I do not just memorise those algorithms. I try and understand what they are doing optimally so can adapt that for open slots.

 

[Godmil]

I'm less and less convinced there is a difference between intuitive and algorithmic... the way I'm seeing it is 'intuitive' means you're working out your own algorithms, the reason it takes so long to get fast at is because there are essentially tons of algs that you're learning. I'd hazard a guess that the end results is exactly the same, you have a Corner and Edge in a position, they have to go in this slot and these slots are free. I bet given a case several times someone will do it exactly the same each time (regardless if they learned the case by intuition or algorithms).