Solve Rubik's Cube? You Liar!!

[hait2]

So, if I want to get faster, I should learn the algorithm first? Since I only undestand some of the Mr. Badmephisto's explanation......

Well I thought the point of the thread was to solve the cube intuitively, on your own, rather than being fast. For pure speed and sighted solving, I wouldn't recommend a commutator method because you waste moves by affecting only a few pieces.

If you wanted to get fast at BLD though, that's a different story. I'd be silly to recommend you any other method than commutators/freestyle there (primarily because knowing this lets you understand any other method with ease and incorporate them as you see fit)

but feel free to post any questions you have regarding the video or commutators/whatever in general, I (and many others I'm sure) would be happy to answer you

 

[Karthik]

Commutators aren't that bad for speed.I am sure you can sub-30 using commutators.And I think that is decent speed.

 

[cmhardw]

I just tried some solving variations, using only intuitive methods.

When I solve use nothing but commutators (using inspection to determine if I have parity, and fixing this with a single quarter turn at the start) then I can get times around 45-50 at my fastest.

I consider F2L to be intuitive by this point, since the idea is really just about piecing together and placing blocks. Using F2L and an intuitive 4 look I can get times around 26-30 on fast solves. My last layer is to flip edges using F R U R' U' F' and its inverse (which is just using Petrus' idea about flipping edges after the 2x2x3 and makes intuitive sense to me). I use the sune to permute edges. Again just think about what you are doing, this is the easiest intuitive way to permute edges after the F2L is solved. For corners I use commutators to both permute and orient them. These are all 100% intuitive.

It feels goofy to me to use commutators in a speedsolve, but yes you can sub-30 with a last layer that uses commutators if you use an intuitive F2L.

Chris

 

[Harry]

ok, For Mr. Hait2, why you will recommend commutators for BLD? and For Mr. Cmhardw, why is it wrong to use commutators in speedsolving?

 

[badmephisto]

Here is what it comes down to, and its pretty simple: Commutators modify very small portion of the cube at expense of speed. In BLD this is good because you dont have to update your mental image of memorized cube too much as you solve, and in Speedsolving this is bad because they are slow to execute. Doesnt it make sense that flipping two single corners on entire cube should be harder than just orienting the last layer, given that you dont care at all where the actual pieces of the last layer are?

 

[Harry]

Why we will not care about the actual pieces? And I thought BLD also about speed? And what you mean by orienting is moving the corner in correct places?

 

[pcwiz]

Why we will not care about the actual pieces? And I thought BLD also about speed? And what you mean by orienting is moving the corner in correct places?

Blindfold isn't really entirely about speed. It's also about memorizing fast. Some people can solve a cube blindfolded in about 15 seconds or less - they use the Fridrich Method. Why don't people use the Fridrich Method for blindfold solving? Because it's hard to memorize. If you tried using it at the competition, you would get like a 10 minute solve - which isn't fast when some people (like Alexander Yu) can get just above a minute (memorizing the cube and solving it).

If you're trying to blindfold solve, and you use a method for speed cubing, it's not easy, especially for the first two layers, and the cross (if you're doing Fridrich or LBL). If you're doing the cross, you don't know what the rest of the cube will look like after you do it. For blindfold solving, that's not too good. Same for the first two layers - once you solve one part, you don't know what happens to the other unsolved parts of the cube. That is hard to keep track of. For commutators, they only make small changes to the cube. You can just memorize where all the pieces of the cube is at the beginning, and solve a few pieces of the cube at a time. The advantage of commutators is when you're solving the cube, the rest of the cube barely changes. So memorizing is MUCH easier, and that's more important than execution time in blindfold solving.

 

[Harry]

Ouw..... OK2. I get it now. After yesterday, I found a guide to commutators. I printed it out but still not memorize it. I want to be able to perfected my solving first. Thanks Guys!!!!!!