30 alg substitute for OLL?

[Joker]

He already knows that, Arctic. He said he knows 2 look.

Use VHF2L if you want to avoid learning OLL algs. You orient edges while playing last F2L pair. Something like 16 cases then mirrors (I might be wrong here). It can also be done quite intuitively. You won't have to learn anymore OLLs that way.

An alternative: Instead of learning 57 OLLs, learn the 40 something COLLs. You get the added benefit of knowing CLL for 2x2 that way, and you will be left with only edge perms (Ua/b, H, Z). Learn fewer algorithms and get three times the benefit.

Or suck it up and practice since OLLs are very easy to learn, the hard part is keeping recognition. Take your time, learn 2-4 OLLs a day and you'll have it done in no time. OLLs (besides dot cases which you should learn first unless you want to be like cincyaviation and use partial edge control so you'll never need to learn those 6 cases) have similar shapes to each other so the algs are very similar (not to mention most of them contain algs that are easy to learn like setup move + eo alg + anti setup move or setup move sune etc).

Also, using COLL for 2x2 may bring your times down a bit, but you aren't very likely to enjoy doing a 15 move 2x2 alg.

Ninja'd. By 10 hours :tu
Lol.

 

[maggot]

just for record*** F R U R' U' F' trigger only solves one OLL (that a 2 look person would see), and when i had 2 look OLL, i didnt relate this to the T dot case, i just relate it to what i do to get the top cross, and it was lucky to get a skip... just like P line case, after making the cross, i got a skip...

i would learn dot case. when done with dot, learn the T cases, learn the H case, and the big fish case. the H case and big fish both give headlights after orienting cross, which i hate. there are a few more that give headlight, but it is like a 50% chance you have it oriented for headlight case, or you would get pi or antisune. im sure there are other OLL that give you different case with opposite orientation of line will give headlight after orienting cross.

a lot of OLL are easy, and for some of the one that suck, you can always use sune variant... wide sune, double wide sune, sune AUF sune, etc. there is a thread on this, sorry i cannot remember who to give credit for, but im sure its someone cheeky lol.

 

[qqwref]

The following suggestions are good ones IMO.
- Learn only 30 OLLs. You can skip the ones with four edges flipped using edge control; for the ones with two edges flipped, don't learn the ugliest ones (i.e. choose the 20 or so nicest ones and do the rest 2-look). Bonus: if you ever want to learn full OLL you're really close.
- Learn the 16 (32 if you don't wanna mirror in your head) algs for VHF2L. Then you would be pairing the F2L pair, inserting while orienting edges, orienting corners, and doing PLL.

I don't suggest learning COLL, unless your edge-only PLLs are way faster than your PLLs, and even in that case it's iffy because the recognition and algs will take a long time to get used to. As far as I can see the only real benefit of COLL and edge-PLL (compared to corner-OLL and PLL) is the increased chance of a skip - the edge-PLL step skips 1/12 of the time.

 

[hawkmp4]

a lot of OLL are easy, and for some of the one that suck, you can always use sune variant... wide sune, double wide sune, sune AUF sune, etc. there is a thread on this, sorry i cannot remember who to give credit for, but im sure its someone cheeky lol.

That was Kir and Robert Yau.
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23222

 

[ChrisBird]

It there a fast alternative that has less algs 30-?

Trust me, with all the time countless people have poured into making/trying to make CFOP faster, if there was a way to do something the same speed with fewer algs, it probably would have been done by now.

 

[ArcticxWolf]

just for record*** F R U R' U' F' trigger only solves one OLL (that a 2 look person would see), and when i had 2 look OLL, i didnt relate this to the T dot case, i just relate it to what i do to get the top cross, and it was lucky to get a skip... just like P line case, after making the cross, i got a skip...

Learn all of the F R U R' U' F' and all of the OLLs which contain them.

With only Sune, Antisune, F R U R' U' F' and setup moves, you can already learn about 35 OLLs with no other knowledge.

Did you even read my posts?

 

[somerandomkidmike]

If you want to be faster, it involves learning more algs. No way around it besides just improving your turn speed.

That's not true. You don't need to learn more algorithms, or improve your turning speed. You just need to know what's coming next.

I realize that this is technically improving your average turning speed, but you're not trying to just turn it faster.

 

[cincyaviation]

If you want to be faster, it involves learning more algs. No way around it besides just improving your turn speed.

That's not true. You don't need to learn more algorithms, or improve your turning speed. You just need to know what's coming next.

I realize that this is technically improving your average turning speed, but you're not trying to just turn it faster.

You can't take advantage of knowing what is coming next without the algs to execute it and the turning speed to do it.

 

[rubiknewbie]

OLLs are easy. Learn it.

 

[dbax0999]

You could learn all the OLLs except for the dot cases. And then use partial edge control to avoid those cases. That'll remove 8 of the harder OLLs. Just a little bit less algs and virtually just as fast.

 

[Joker]

It there a fast alternative that has less algs 30-?

Trust me, with all the time countless people have poured into making/trying to make CFOP faster, if there was a way to do something the same speed with fewer algs, it probably would have been done by now.

Lol true.
And at a certain point you don't care about how many algs you need to learn, as long as it makes you faster.
For instance, some people make algs to skip OLL if they have all edges oriented by the last F2L pair.
Whatever it takes to be fast I guess lol.

 

[rubiknewbie]

For 2H, I think the dot cases are just as easy for OLLs as other cases. In fact they are 1 of the greater benefits of learning OLLs since those cases are difficult to do edge control for, so might as well just solve the orientation completely.

For OH however, the dot cases suck so I would orient 2 edges to convert to easier OLLs.

 

[~Adam~]

That'll remove 8 of the harder OLLs

4 of these 8 are insanely easy (2,3,4 and 17). 20 is fairly easy aswell but is one of the rarest OLLs so if you don't want to learn it you really don't have to.

 

[FatBoyXPC]

Rubiknewbie: the dot cases are the longest move OLLs, and dot cases are the easiest cases to do edge control for (you can't really count it as control if the edges are already oriented correctly). When you have no edges oriented (ie what will be a dot case OLL) you can do a sledgehammer and solve that problem real quick.

 

[Rpotts]

Rubiknewbie: the dot cases are the longest move OLLs, and dot cases are the easiest cases to do edge control for (you can't really count it as control if the edges are already oriented correctly). When you have no edges oriented (ie what will be a dot case OLL) you can do a sledgehammer and solve that problem real quick.

except when the final pair is R U R' insert.

LEARN OLL

 

[Kenneth]

[wiki]Roux[/wiki] uses lesser algs than Fridrich, [wiki]Heise[/wiki] uses "no algs", [wiki]Petrus[/wiki] uses 7 OLL's (or [wiki]COLL[/wiki]) so there are alternatives, but they all include [wiki]block building[/wiki] for F2L and that takes much longer to learn to do fast than cross-pairs.