Moneys way to BLD solving : M2/R2 help

[MrMoney]

Hi guys,

for quite some time I have read threads here in the forum, and been really facinated with BLD solving. I learned a really bad/slow method at first, and can now solve the cube in 3-5minutes (not including inspection!).

This method was first orienting corners 1 at the time, then permuting them with J perms, and lastly pochman orient+perm edhes with J(a), J(b) and T perms.

This made each solve about 300-400 turns, not really fast.

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So now I am trying to learn a really fast method, and from what I understand M2/R2 is one of the ways to go! So this thread will focus on all my questions around the method, hopefully someone will help

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FIRST QUESTION

Right now I am beginning to understand the method, but still only attempting the solves sighted and intuitive. I first solve edges, clean up misoriented pieces, solve corners, clearn up pieces, and then fix parity.

Sometimes when I solve the corners, I end up with edges wrong in the R2 layer. It is actually a H perm that needs to be performed. What is this? :S I Cannot find that much info on the internet about the method :-/

SECOND QUESTION
I use letters to remember edgestickers, but what do you do for corners (since there are 3sides?). Do you use letters for these do? Seems very hard to remember roughly 20-25 letters each solve +parity+misorients

 

[4Chan]

Oh, if you have an H perm in the R layer, it sounds like youre missing one last R2, so you have an odd number of cycles. So, that's a parity in a sense.

In reply to the second question: with practice, you can do the corners completely visual.

 

[deadalnix]

For the corners, considering your past, you should try 3OP .

It's very close from your old method, but can be really fast on corners (less on edges).

For the rest, M2 is really powerfull on edges, but R2 has a lots of crappy cases in proportion.

For corner, you should memorize it at the end and solve it in first. So you can use only a short term memory. So you can use visual memory or kynestesic memory (I'm not sure of this word in english, basicaly memory with fingers).

For the H perm you are probably confused by slot shifting at each R2.

 

[MrMoney]

Is it maybe better to use "old pochman" corners and m2? Seems like there are less "special" cases and very easy to fix parity.

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Read about 3OP on mackys site (cubefreak), felt it was reaaaally hard to understand.

Thanks for all help guys

 

[deadalnix]

If you want an effective method, don't choose old pochman (~ 20mvts/corner).

3OP isn't really hard and very similar to what you are using before. This is also very fast.

 

[MrMoney]

Anyone got a link to a good 3OP corner guide? Or want to write one?

Mackys site ws really hard to understand, and it seems his algorithms switched edges too (the monoflip). Wierd.

 

[deadalnix]

Just use it for corners, keep M2 for edges. You'll get a good method.

The weak point of 3OP is edges, the weak point of M2/R2 is corners You get my point ?

 

[MrMoney]

Yea, I think I will have a nice "hybrid" method there M2/3OP.

Will spend some time tonight figuring out corners, and what "parity" issues will arise!

What I mean abose Is that monoflip (which is supposed to switch 3corners clockwise) also flips edges. Did not fully understand why do that.

 

[deadalnix]

No, you do not move edge during corner solve.

For 3OP, I use the followinf subset of algs :
A perm
xD2RUR'D2RU'Rx' (and mirror/reverse).
UR2D'R2'U'R2UR2'DR2U'R2'

You can also use some trickes like U2 then H perm, E perm, and (R'FRF')3

 

[Marcell]

Monoflip itself turns one corner clockwise, while mixing up other pieces. You always do monoflips in pairs, where the second monoflip (the inverse of the first) turns another corner counter-clockwise and restores the pieces that have been mixed up by the first monoflip.
I suggest that you read Macky's description again.

 

[deadalnix]

Haaaaa !

I see what is confusing you ! The monoflip way to orient from cubefreak isn't really so simple. But very customizable.

Anyway, you have already an orientation step in your old method, so begin by doing like you already know how to and improve it later

 

[MrMoney]

Thanks guys, means alot getting help by you all Will post more problems as they arise

 

[Zeroknight]

Anyone got a link to a good 3OP corner guide? Or want to write one?

Mackys site ws really hard to understand, and it seems his algorithms switched edges too (the monoflip). Wierd.

Hey man, sorry to hijack this topic, but Macky's site is a bit hard to understand, and assumes your deep in cube theory. I'd like to know everything he's talking about, but sadly I do not. Is there another, less esoteric one? Thanks in advance.

 

[deadalnix]

I don't know (I have written one in french, but I will probably not help you).

But this is really simple : first orient corners using, for exemple double sune (left then right).

Then you can permute them with A perm and H perm then U2. Really 3OP on corner is really simple and very effective !