Would you like speedcubing to become really popular?

[Lord Voldemort]

@ fanwuq - How is chess street smarts? I found that amusing

 

[fanwuq]

If you only hang out with your friends online and not meet them in person, you are avoidant, and possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.

I'm antisocial, but I hang out with my friends in person and not online, and I don't play video games, so I don't see the correlation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder
I'm staying away from you.

There is a correlation, but it is not 100% positive or negative.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...serid=10&md5=ac65e8118d038e678f0a78579c79cc19



Airman 1st Class Voldemort,
Chess involves a bit of free thinking; it's not something you can learn from a school class; it requires a bit of experience with interacting with other people.

 

[qqwref]

you are ... possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.

I think I ought to butt in here to say that if someone plays violent video games it does not at all mean that they themselves are a violent person. People who play video games involving (for instance) killing people do not typically end up murdering someone in real life (although the small number of people who acturally do want to kill someone in real life very often end up playing those kind of video games). I think that many people have a violent instinct - whether it comes from anger/frustration, curiosity, or sadism - and, even though I personally am not a fan of violent games, I would say it is clearly better for people to curb that by playing violent games than by actually hurting people.

Anyway, video games are pretty popular... the most popular kids in school may not spend much time gaming, but a lot of people are into games these days. Considering that large segment of American kids and teens, it's nothing more than a fallacy to say that people who spend a lot of time playing video games are antisocial. Typically, part of the draw is the social aspect: many of the most popular games nowadays are as popular as they are because of the ability to play against and communicate with other people. Many of these games involve teamwork, too, such as World of Warcraft, where players are encouraged to band together in groups to complete the more difficult quests. So while people who spend hours each day playing games may not be engaging in normal social behavior, it's extremely inaccurate to say they are not interested in socializing. I know a lot of people who play video games and none of them have anything approaching Antisocial Personality Disorder.

 

[JTW2007]

If you only hang out with your friends online and not meet them in person, you are avoidant, and possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.

I'm antisocial, but I hang out with my friends in person and not online, and I don't play video games, so I don't see the correlation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder
I'm staying away from you.

Okay, so I'm not technically antisocial, but I generally dislike large groups of people.

 

[Lord Voldemort]

Airman 1st Class Voldemort,
Chess involves a bit of free thinking; it's not something you can learn from a school class; it requires a bit of experience with interacting with other people.

Well, it's to me it seems more logical, at least at the higher levels.
A computer could analyze a position and give you a definite best move (well, not yet perhaps, but we'll get there soon), then free thinking probably isn't involved.

 

[fanwuq]

you are ... possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.

I think I ought to butt in here to say that if someone plays violent video games it does not at all mean that they themselves are a violent person. People who play video games involving (for instance) killing people do not typically end up murdering someone in real life (although the small number of people who acturally do want to kill someone in real life very often end up playing those kind of video games). I think that many people have a violent instinct - whether it comes from anger/frustration, curiosity, or sadism - and, even though I personally am not a fan of violent games, I would say it is clearly better for people to curb that by playing violent games than by actually hurting people.

Anyway, video games are pretty popular... the most popular kids in school may not spend much time gaming, but a lot of people are into games these days. Considering that large segment of American kids and teens, it's nothing more than a fallacy to say that people who spend a lot of time playing video games are antisocial. Typically, part of the draw is the social aspect: many of the most popular games nowadays are as popular as they are because of the ability to play against and communicate with other people. Many of these games involve teamwork, too, such as World of Warcraft, where players are encouraged to band together in groups to complete the more difficult quests. So while people who spend hours each day playing games may not be engaging in normal social behavior, it's extremely inaccurate to say they are not interested in socializing. I know a lot of people who play video games and none of them have anything approaching Antisocial Personality Disorder.

I mostly agree, hence the possibly. Video games are popular in the sense that a lot of people play them, but I still don't think they are popular in the sense that they are played by the "cool people."
Video games do have the possible good effect of allowing people to vent their anger, but these people already have emotional issues without video games. There are better treatments and this could possibly have a negative impact. That is not the main issue with video games. The main issue is that there are better things to do in life than playing videos. If playing video games all day is your idea of the ideal day, then you are as good as dead. It is something to do when you get really bored and there is nothing else to do; it should not be one of your main activities.
I would say people who spent much time playing video games do have Avoidant personality disorder. They are trying to cope with their inability to interact with others in the real world. In the virtual world, they can hide behind a mask and not risk being humiliated.


Voldemort,

In school, a good memory gets you further than good understanding in most subjects. Sometimes you can attempt to confuse your opponents. I'm not at a high chess playing level, but I know that it is more of flexibly thinking for yourself than knowing the textbook answer.

 

[Lord Voldemort]

I don't mind violent video games myself (it does get annoying when people fail to see a good game unless it has a lot of blood...), but haven't video games also been shown it increase violence in children? That's what the ratings are for, but a lot of people don't follow them.

Now I'm not even worthy of Airman 1st Class?

EDIT: I know what you're talking about now with chess though. Lots of people will just go on memorizing openings with the knowledge that they're doing the "best" move. Then, when someone opposing them doesn't do the "best" move, they can't even make a good move sometimes because they don't actually think, let alone turning it to their advantage.

 

[JTW2007]

A computer could analyze a position and give you a definite best move (well, not yet perhaps, but we'll get there soon), then free thinking probably isn't involved.

Computers play without any personality, which is why I don't like playing them. A computer would almost certainly never play a hypermodern opening, because it wouldn't be traditionally correct chess. I think that in order for chess to be fun, you and your opponent have to put a small amount of personality into your game.

 

[jcuber]

If you only hang out with your friends online and not meet them in person, you are avoidant, and possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.

I'm antisocial, but I hang out with my friends in person and not online, and I don't play video games, so I don't see the correlation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder
I'm staying away from you.

Okay, so I'm not technically antisocial, but I generally dislike large groups of people.

Most people also dislike traffic, which involves large groups of people in cars.

3. Since when were video games "cool"? Are you in elementary school? Usually only the anti-social people are serious about video games. If you always talk about video games with your "friends," you don't have a life. I met this one kid at my school who said that if he could do anything for one day, he would stay home to sleep and play his video games. You don't know how disgusted I felt after hearing that from a so called "human being." That is not natural and I like to think that the majority of the human race is above that.
4. You assumptions about the United States is just wrong. It is definitely the other way around. Sorry to say this, but Americans fail at arithmetic, but generally have good general problem solving skills. I know many people who still count using their fingers in the US. In China, almost everyone knows his multiplication and periodic tables by heart. In America, Home Depot is a pretty popular store; very few places like that in China. People actually solve their own problems at home using logic in America. Fixing your own roof and painting your own house is real life problem solving.

What about doing splitscreen with friends?

I agree, most of us americans are dumbasses. Most probably including me.

lolwut?
You fail to see the point. You don't agree... unless "dumbasses" have good problem solving skills?
Video games aren't exactly stupid. They are just lame; it's not what "cool" people do. Maybe an occasional game once a few months or so. If it is one of your main hobbies, you are certainly in trouble.
If you only hang out with your friends online and not meet them in person, you are avoidant, and possibly even anti-social if you play violent games.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avoidant_personality_disorder

Sorry, highlighted the wrong text. should be the above version.

I was only giving an example using splitscreen videogames as an example.

anyway, a good hour long session of any GTA is enough to relieve a week's worth of school stress.

 

[Rama]

I have mixed feelings about it. On the one hand, the more people get into cubing, the more likely we can get money and sponsorship for holding tournaments and such, which are always fun.

On the other hand, I've also noticed how the culture of our community has changed as it's gotten bigger. Back in the day cubers were people who were willing to seek out information themselves and try new things. Now we get newbies asking the same questions over and over even as a wealth of information is right in front of their faces, and are afraid to do something as simple as lube their cube if nobody's there to hold their hand through the process. I kind of miss the old days.

+1

 

[Rama]

I want many more people who understand cube theory, have a sense of humor, and are willing to try many different events and puzzles, but I don't want to have to deal with a huge number of incomprehensible newbies. Can I just have the first group? Please?

You fail to realize in order to have group 1, you have to have group 2. You were a newbie once, too.

Not really. I was a *beginner* but I was never the kind of noob that you see nowadays, who ask tons of stupid questions, can't understand any tutorial unless it is on youtube, and don't know how to write English. When I started out I had the common sense to observe the forums (lurk) and read up on cubing before I started posting, instead of immediately making topics as soon as I could solve a cube. There is a huge difference between a newcomer and a noob; while someone who is just new may someday become a respected member of the community, a user who starts off looking like an idiot and stays that way never will be.

Epical +1 for you Michael!
I can recall saying the same thing a while ago!

 

[Sin-H]

I want many more people who understand cube theory, have a sense of humor, and are willing to try many different events and puzzles, but I don't want to have to deal with a huge number of incomprehensible newbies. Can I just have the first group? Please?

You fail to realize in order to have group 1, you have to have group 2. You were a newbie once, too.

Not really. I was a *beginner* but I was never the kind of noob that you see nowadays, who ask tons of stupid questions, can't understand any tutorial unless it is on youtube, and don't know how to write English. When I started out I had the common sense to observe the forums (lurk) and read up on cubing before I started posting, instead of immediately making topics as soon as I could solve a cube. There is a huge difference between a newcomer and a noob; while someone who is just new may someday become a respected member of the community, a user who starts off looking like an idiot and stays that way never will be.

Epical +1 for you Michael!
I can recall saying the same thing a while ago!

oh yess

 

[Lumej]

I think it depends on how you define "popular".

If it means that more people know that speedcubing exists, that there's a higher level of awareness, and if they're interested they look into it and join the community, then yes, I think speedcubing should definitely become more popular.

But if it's more like a craze or a fad, everyone just doing it because everyone is doing it.... I could imagine this happening, at least in my town or so. But maybe you (the posters before me) are right with your assumption that maybe not cubing, but at least speedcubing is far to much work, so that a fad wouldn't actually happen.
So I'd not like speedcubing to become "popular" in such a way. (everyone doing it because everyone is doing it / fad)

 

[rahulkadukar]

I prefer it the way it is (without media coverage) anyway the number of competitions held every year is increasing and this is a good sign.

 

[Johannes91]

Well, it's to me it [chess] seems more logical, at least at the higher levels.

Knowledge is a big part on the very high levels. But it's possible to get fairly strong (2000+ at least) without much "book knowledge" by having a deep understanding, and vice versa.

A computer could analyze a position and give you a definite best move (well, not yet perhaps, but we'll get there soon)

Soon? Chess is far from solved.

A computer would almost certainly never play a hypermodern opening, because it wouldn't be traditionally correct chess.

That doesn't make sense. Computers use the opening books the programmers/chess experts give them. Making the program start "thinking" on its own from the first move would be dumb considering the ridiculous amounts of opening theory we have these days.

And even without hard-coded books modern openings would be possible; computers care about "traditional correctness" just as much as they are told to.

I think that in order for chess to be fun, you and your opponent have to put a small amount of personality into your game.

I don't think it's important at all. "I play against the pieces."

On-topic: I don't care much. I would like to see other aspects of cubing become more common among speedsolvers, though.

 

[Stefan]

I'm very surprised about this thread. I actually thought it was a stupid question, voted yes, and then noticed that I was actually in the minority!

Same here. But it's an optical illusion, you see. While it seems that the majority of the speedcubing population would not like speedcubing to become popular, it's just the other way around, because the first two added up are actually the group that would like for it to be popular.
So, at the results right now:
I would like/not mind if it were popular: 47
I wouldn't like it if it were popular: 42

Wrong.

There's no option "I wouldn't mind if speedcubing didn't become popular". That means the people who would vote this, and in general all who don't care, only have the existing "I wouldn't mind" option. Therefore you cannot rightfully go ahead and declare all of these "pro-popular". Since you don't know, you cannot meaningfully count these votes either way. There might actually be more "pro" people than "contra" people, but you can't infer that from this biased unbalanced poll.

Btw, that wouldn't be an "optical illusion" even if you were right. I think you just said that to make yourself sound more interesting.

 

[Anthony]

I prefer it the way it is (without media coverage)

Well, cubing does get some media coverage. Local newspapers and TV stations frequently have short segments on a nearby competition. I'm assuming you mean without a lot of media coverage.

Although, it's not always local, Tyson blindsolved on CNN once. Then he was obviously on Good Morning America more recently.

Which reminds me, last year I was on the computer and I remember my mom yelling for me to come over and take a look at the TV. The UK Open was mentioned on CNN or Fox, I forget which. It surprised me because I live in Texas lol.

 

[Thieflordz5]

If it was more popular there would be more demand for cubes so cube prices would be lower and we could get our cubes in the us easier and faster. we might see some better speed cubes idk just some thoughts. I do also like the fact that not a lot of ppl can solve one you feel like you have accomplished something by solving it.

No, that would mean demand would go up for cubes, causing them to cost more, you have it backwards.

 

[SlaughterMelon]

1. Why can't Poker be for smart people? I remember a mathematician came to my school once to talk about cryptography to play poker using some sort of number transformations. Also you can probably calculate the probability of getting the card you want.
2. If chess isn't mainstream, cubing will never be mainstream. Funny thing is that at my school, only a few of the "smarter" people play chess, many of the people who fail classes are actually really good at it. Chess is definitely more street smarts than book smarts.
3. Since when were video games "cool"? Are you in elementary school? Usually only the avoidant/anti-social people are serious about video games. If you always talk about video games with your "friends," you don't have a life. I met this one kid at my school who said that if he could do anything for one day, he would stay home to sleep and play his video games. You don't know how disgusted I felt after hearing that from a so called "human being." That is not natural and I like to think that the majority of the human race is above that.
4. You assumptions about the United States is just wrong. It is definitely the other way around. Sorry to say this, but Americans fail at arithmetic, but generally have good general problem solving skills. I know many people who still count using their fingers in the US. In China, almost everyone knows his multiplication and periodic tables by heart. In America, Home Depot is a pretty popular store; very few places like that in China. People actually solve their own problems at home using logic in America. Fixing your own roof and painting your own house is real life problem solving.

1. Ok, fine. I had something here, but I completely forgot what it was
2. Actually, I have noticed that Chess is very popular with people who fail classes, too. The thing is, at least at my school (Arizona, here), these people (not trying to be racist or offensive or anything) are mostly Native American outcasts, many considered to be "antisocial."
3. Actually, I'm a high school senior Class of 2010, baby! And it's not "video games" that are popular, it is the game (Halo, Guitar Hero, etc.) that is popular. Many of the "cool, social" people I know are hardcore Halo or GH players, or at least consider themselves to be (playing on expert, maybe not Dragonforce, but other things). And you assume that games are not a social activity. I find that most people play games online, with other people (even if those other people are prepubescent teens cracking "yo momma" jokes over XBL), or playing GH or Halo with their friends at their house, before/after seeing a movie. Also, most hardcore gamers are not "antisocial" or "avoidant" (not talking about the disorder, here). Most hardcore gamers I know, at least, are looking for every chance to meet with their community/clan friends at various Cons or meet ups.
4. That's not the point. The point is we're TRAINED in school to do good on tests, which are pre-made to have "perfect" answers. Our textbooks are not formatted to teach us problem solving skills, they are formatted to teach us how to factor binomials, and add fractions. When you're in an Algebra math class in ANY city in the United States, anyone can tell you the formula of a line, anyone can tell you the quadratic formula, but no one knows how to pull the correct data out of a real life situation (not a pre-made word problem), and use the formulas correctly.

Not really. I was a *beginner* but I was never the kind of noob that you see nowadays, who ask tons of stupid questions, can't understand any tutorial unless it is on youtube, and don't know how to write English. When I started out I had the common sense to observe the forums (lurk) and read up on cubing before I started posting, instead of immediately making topics as soon as I could solve a cube. There is a huge difference between a newcomer and a noob; while someone who is just new may someday become a respected member of the community, a user who starts off looking like an idiot and stays that way never will be.

That's you. That's not every other "noob" who comes here. And just because they start out typing in 13375p34k (leetspeak, for those "not in the know"), doesn't mean you can't shape them to become what you want them to become (even if it means making a 10 part youtube video of cubetheory 101).

 

[teller]

If it was more popular there would be more demand for cubes so cube prices would be lower and we could get our cubes in the us easier and faster. we might see some better speed cubes idk just some thoughts. I do also like the fact that not a lot of ppl can solve one you feel like you have accomplished something by solving it.

No, that would mean demand would go up for cubes, causing them to cost more, you have it backwards.

Wrong. See my post above and learn some economics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economies_of_scale