Isaac Lai
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Yes. I agree, but multiple people have said that the scramble could have been generated by the scrambling program, so it is in many ways as good as random state.
[WR] Feliks Zemdegs 3x3 OH single 6.88
- Thread starter Tim Major
- Start date
Yes. I agree, but multiple people have said that the scramble could have been generated by the scrambling program, so it is in many ways as good as random state.
tseitsei
Veteran
This thread proves 3 things:
1: Feliks is very honest and truthfull competitor.
2: He desrves the wr. He did everything he could to be as fair and truthfull as he could.
3: ban me if you will but I'll say it. MiDiPalma is a ****ing idiot. And should be banned IMO. He just wants to make things difficult and believe the worst about everyone. Please stop doing that. You are just being an idiot.
1: Feliks is very honest and truthfull competitor.
2: He desrves the wr. He did everything he could to be as fair and truthfull as he could.
3: ban me if you will but I'll say it. MiDiPalma is a ****ing idiot. And should be banned IMO. He just wants to make things difficult and believe the worst about everyone. Please stop doing that. You are just being an idiot.
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vcuber13
Veteran
The state is random, but it was not randomly chosen.
the state was, though, proven to be just as random as a scramble that WAS random state. It was very feasible that the R' could have just as well been the R.
No, this does not give a fair playing field for all of the competitors.
And no, there's nothing that can be done about it, since misscrambles will always happen.
The WCA board decided that it was okay to keep, and I trust their decisions.
Are you on the board, Matt?
No.
This is their organization, and if you don't like how it's run, don't be a part of it, and certainly don't be argumentative on a forum that is highly supportive of them.
\end rant
No, this does not give a fair playing field for all of the competitors.
And no, there's nothing that can be done about it, since misscrambles will always happen.
The WCA board decided that it was okay to keep, and I trust their decisions.
Are you on the board, Matt?
No.
This is their organization, and if you don't like how it's run, don't be a part of it, and certainly don't be argumentative on a forum that is highly supportive of them.
\end rant
Lchu613
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miDiPalma;s first point, abridged: Feliks must have cheated by getting a scrambler to somehow run a computer program or mis-scramble multiple times, since his scramble is "significantly easier" than the others
Reply to point one: Correlation != causation; you have no actual evidence that he cheated, and your accusations honestly just make you look kind of bad. Especially since you augment your argument by calling your audience sheep and painting the WCA as a big bad enemy of the people
Considering whether the solve should be considered legitimate is definitely relevant grounds for discussion here (IMO), but it would be great to see some unbiased arguments grounded in actual WCA legislature and actual evidence.
Reply to point one: Correlation != causation; you have no actual evidence that he cheated, and your accusations honestly just make you look kind of bad. Especially since you augment your argument by calling your audience sheep and painting the WCA as a big bad enemy of the people
Considering whether the solve should be considered legitimate is definitely relevant grounds for discussion here (IMO), but it would be great to see some unbiased arguments grounded in actual WCA legislature and actual evidence.
AustinReed
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To play the Devil's Advocate, just because the community agrees on something doesn't necessarily make it right.
I don't think Feliks cheated or that anyone did anything intentionally malicious, but I feel a bit weird that they accepted the record.
I agree somewhat, but I trust their decisions. I don't think this is what went on:
"omg faz got oh wr that was soooo fazt but miscramble so ..."
"frick it just let it by."
as Mr. DiPlama seems to think. I trust that they had their reasons, and anyway, it's beyond my control.
AustinReed
Veteran
At the same time, I think the decision was made WAY too fast considering this is such a huge jump in time. I think people don't want to admit that the misscramble WAS easier. I sure think it was. I don't care HOW much easier. Let's be real. It was easier.
And I'm not going to stand by DiPalma's words, but I think people need to lay off him. Let him say what he wants to say. Who cares? This is turning quickly into a personal flame war.
As much as i'm inclined to argree with you, that we shouldn't care what he says, it's very difficult to watch and not respond when someone disses the WCA, and everyone who follows them. As my parents told me, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it at all. and what Matt said was definitely not nice
mDiPalma
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Clarification. I never specifically accused anyone of cheating.
Faz is just about the last person I'd ever accuse of cheating. He doesn't NEED to cheat.
I'm just saying that the WCA ought to consider the possibility of cheating in their rulings.
...because if this 6.88 wasn't done by Feliks, but by Mr. Bob Smith, a random competitor with NO previous competitions and a 30-second OH average, I have a feeling that many people on this thread would be accusing him of cheating in the SAME way that I have outlined (getting someone to mis-scramble the cube for an easier cross-F2L).
I'd expect the WCA to disqualify the attempt of Bob Smith, because the scramble wasn't random state, it wasn't checked, and he wasn't awarded another attempt. And to BE FAIR, I must extend this expectation for WCA rulings against legitimate competitors like Faz.
Faz is Faz. He can get legitimate WRs easy peasy. If he really deserves the WR, he will get it again, even if they disqualify this (illegal) 6.88 attempt.
WCA regulations exist TO PROHIBIT cheating, so they ought to be followed explicitly. Delegate and Board leniency is what people will take advantage of to cheat. You can't disagree with that.
I think, in that situation, that the WCA would also not DNF Bob Smith, unless there was any proof he cheated. There is no proof of cheating in this case, and there if there was in that case, I believe that the WCA would not DNF it either. But, chances are, if Bob Smith legitimately got that on a misscramble, the misscramble would be significantly easier than the original scramble, which is not the case in this.
Clarification: while this scramble may be easier than the original, in Bob Smith's case, it almost certainly be MUCH more easier.
Who decides what is too easy in the case of the misscrable? The WCA.
also, to be clear, I am not attacking you personally. I just think your views are off. Sorry If I seem unnecessarily angry in any of these posts
AustinReed
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I think, in that situation, that the WCA would also not DNF Bob Smith, unless there was any proof he cheated. There is no proof of cheating in this case, and there if there was in that case, I believe that the WCA would not DNF it either. But, chances are, if Bob Smith legitimately got that on a misscramble, the misscramble would be significantly easier than the original scramble, which is not the case in this.
Clarification: while this scramble may be easier than the original, in Bob Smith's case, it almost certainly be MUCH more easier.
Who decides what is too easy in the case of the misscrable? The WCA.
also, to be clear, I am not attacking you personally. I just think your views are off. Sorry If I seem unnecessarily angry in any of these posts
I would want to think that the WCA wouldn't DNF him under the same pretenses, but I think they would and I think no one would question it. From the other post you made, I don't see the problem in dissing the WCA. If you think they made the wrong decision, by all means, speak your mind. I think the "don't say anything if you don't have anything nice to say" mentality is more elementary-school oriented. We (as in the human race) would be nowhere if we didn't say "mean" things.
I don't believe in saying unnecessarily rude things, period. Have at it with speaking your mind, but don't be rude about it in such a positive community
Isaac Lai
Veteran
The problem with comparing a solve by faz and a solve by bob smith is that for bob smith, a 30 second solver, to get 6.88, he would need something ridiculous like a double xcross and LL skip. Faz can get 6.88 on a legit scramble, albeit with a bit (but not a ridiculous amount) of luck. If bob smith were to get such a scramble, it would be a case very much similar to Grzegorez Prusak's Square-1 solve, where the difference in difficulty between scrambles was way too large for the WCA to be able to consider the solve as 'legal'.
AustinReed
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Sorry to break it to you, but this is not a positive community, lol.
Lchu613
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Thanks for the clarification there. I agree that that is a legitimate point, especially with regard to other cases (and perhaps even in this case, though I think we're pretty confident Feliks wouldn't cheat intentionally).
Not with that attitude.
and please show me how it isn't, lol.
AustinReed
Veteran
Well I should probably clarify what you mean by a "positive" community.
supportive, helpful, kind, etc
AustinReed
Veteran
How about some of this (Love you Stefan)
and some of this (And Thom)
You can look at this thread for some name slinging. (I don't care who started it, you don't fight fire with fire.)
The Force Cube thread was a good one before it got taken down, but I'm not going to go through all of the forum for this stuff.
Call me jaded, but ever since I've been here I've known that cubers "keep it real". Honestly, I prefer it that way.
and some of this (And Thom)
You can look at this thread for some name slinging. (I don't care who started it, you don't fight fire with fire.)
The Force Cube thread was a good one before it got taken down, but I'm not going to go through all of the forum for this stuff.
Call me jaded, but ever since I've been here I've known that cubers "keep it real". Honestly, I prefer it that way.
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