Team Blind Discussion thread

[Ranzha]

Yes, it's finally here. I've wanted one of these for awhile, and upon noticing there wasn't anything, I decided to make my own thread.

Here is the Team BLD discussion thread. Here, you discuss...well...Team BLD. Fairly simple concept, I could imagine. You can discuss codes, regulations, anything. Keep it calm and collected, as to provide the ambiance as described in the forum rules, yada yada.

Team 3x3x3 Blindfolded Proposed Regulations
These were adapted from Vincent Sheu's proposed regulations, here.

[/spoiler]

Discuss.

 

[trying-to-speedcube...]

Has anyone ever had this? You're solving, and your caller walks away without you noticing. When you realize you haven't had any calls for about 20 seconds you pull off the blindfold and everyone's laughing at you.
Conny @{

 

[Robert-Y]

I wonder how fast people can do team BLD solves without using any codes, just one move at a time e.g. "R, U, x'" etc...

 

[Cubenovice]

I am currently trying to team BLD with my daughter where she is calling the colors of my Old Pochmann buffer pieces.

This is part of my devious plot to teach her BLD without she realising it ;-)
She is already using some codes for the pieces. If she doesn't know the code she tells the colors and asks the code for it.

We are not quite there yet as breaking into new cycles and dealing with flipped corners are difficult for her to describe.
Perhaps a challenging approach BUT... If she can tell me all the info she understands Old Pochmann.

 

[Stefan]

picture

Helmet + Camera = Win

I wonder how fast people can do team BLD solves without using any codes, just one move at a time e.g. "R, U, x'" etc...

Yes, I could imagine that being quite fast as well, especially with a good names for moves. Here's something I've been thinking of:

Consonants for sides: L, R, F, B, T(op), K (bottom)
(T instead of U to have a consonant, and K instead of D because D can be confused with B)

Vocals for angles:
- quarter turn clockwise: A as in Obama
- quarter turn counterclockwise: I as in "inverted" (not as in "wine")
- half turn: U as in "two" (or "Bruce")

So for example R U2 R' F U F' becomes RaTuRi FaTaFi. This way it's fewer syllables so should be faster to say, plus every move having the same sound length might be better for rhythm. Also should make it easier to remember more moves for the cross. I think at least for cross and for special cases in F2L this would be good, could be combined with codes for standard F2L/OLL/PLL cases.

Consonants G, H, J, M/N, S, W, X and Z sound different enough and could be used in addition, for cube turns or double layer turns or slice turns.

This is part of my devious plot to teach her BLD without she realising it ;-)

Clever. I've done team bld with non-cubers using regular bld methods before, but never in order to teach them anything...

 

[Olivér Perge]

(T instead of U to have a consonant, and K instead of D because D can be confused with B)

That's a sweet idea! We always have a U as AUF and U as permutation madness with Milán.

The best PLL case is where you have to do a U turn to setup the U perm and a U turn to solve the LL. It's like: U! No, not that U, that U! Ok, now U! No! U! U prime, U perm and U! No, not that U!

 

[Stefan]

Yeah, no two codes (for single moves or move sequences) should be so easy to confuse. You could say "perm U", "perm F", "orient W", etc. Or have word-codes for sequences, maybe starting with the step initials, e.g., Frank/Fork/Faz/etc for F2L and Puke(=Uperm)/Pun(=U'perm)/Pork/etc for PLL. Not really necessary, but it might make learning them easier.

 

[cubedude7]

Lol XD, who was your caller?

Has anyone ever had this? You're solving, and your caller walks away without you noticing. When you realize you haven't had any calls for about 20 seconds you pull off the blindfold and everyone's laughing at you.
Conny @{

 

[~Phoenix Death~]

When me and Lorenzo/cubes meet at Cube Meets, we do Team BLD just fo' fun.

 

[AnnoyingApple]

Remember Kai's attempt on Team BLD? I'm still itching to know the codes they used.

 

[Ranzha]

Good to see this thread coming along.
I think it'd be good that after awhile, in the original post, I'd add in a regulation list at the top and whatnot. I think this will benefit any incoming Team BLDers and give them insight on how exactly Team BLD is to be executed.
This does mean that the regulations will be agreed upon here. You guys up for that?

Okay, so when Nathaniel first sat down in the seats at Stanford EPGY Winter 2010, we didn't know what we were going to do. We had never tried TBLD, let alone with each other.
So we tried stuff out, and it wasn't working because of recognition issues.
Because of this, we worked out recognition issues over Skype calls and through a collaborative Google doc.
One major thing I think that a lot of people don't realize is that it's tough to do TBLD because of recognition. Additionally, the caller has to be accustomed to calling things like F2L. The caller and solver must agree upon how to go about performing TBLD before it can actually be done, unless solves are called without codes.
For instance, in a video my father shot of TBLD at Stanford EPGY '10, Nathaniel (the caller) called an anticlockwise U-perm. He recognized like this:

But I recognize like this:

They're the same case, but from different angles. So I performed my alg for the solved-on-B version, and ended with a Z-perm because of this issue. This wastes valuable time if you're competing in Team BLD as an unofficial event. I think that every pair of Team BLDers should create a spreadsheet with sheets detailing how to call triggers (such as Nathaniel's "derp", R U R'), how to call OLL (both for 2-look and for full), and how to call PLL (like how I recognize T-, J-, L-, Ra-, Rb-, F-, E-perm with corner swap on the right side), such as THIS SPREADSHEET.

For OLL, it gets stupid sometimes. That's why you make a table in Word and convert to PDF, as it is on our OLL sheet.

With the tools to do Team BLD, then it gets down to practice. Practise on Skype! It's fun! But it's aso dangerous: if the caller calls something WRONG, it's a DNF. xP

--Ranzha


P.S.

Helmet + Camera = Win

Oh, thanks. ^_^
Stanford EPGY Winter 2010. Funfunfun. But we missed the finals due to Nathaniel's nubbery. But whatevs. We woulda gotten second to Lucas and Sherrey, iirc.
But the camera was angled too high. I still have the failed recordings.

Vocals for angles:
- quarter turn clockwise: A as in Obama
- quarter turn counterclockwise: U as in Bruce
- half turn: I as in Mississippi

So for example R U2 R' F U F' becomes RaTuRi FaTaFi.

From what you posted, wouldn't it be RaTiRu FaTaFu?

 

[Stefan]

From what you posted, wouldn't it be RaTiRu FaTaFu?

*****, yeah. The example is correct, the definition is wrong, I'll go back and fix it. The reasoning was "A" as the alphabet's first letter describing the usually first described angle, "I" reminding of "inverted" or "prime", and "U" reminding of "two" (I chose U rather than O because the sound differs more from A and because of how you pronounce "two").

Coincidentally, you'd then say "Tu" like "two" for U2, which I find nice.

Stuff like "derp" for R U R' might still be better for F2L, though, I admit. But I do think that at least for cross, it could be good, because that is more chaotic and it is memorized before executed.

 

[lorki3]

Mats and I have our own method, its called the family method. XD
Its for the F2L. Every slot has someone of your family. For example: FR slot is your brother/sister. The "broken pair" R U R' is always a woman, also from different angles.
And the already made pair R U' R' also from different angles is always a man.
I'm not going to explain everything but you will probaly understand.

Thijs

 

[Lucas Garron]

Coincidentally, you'd then say "Tu" like "two" for U2, which I find nice.

Stuff like "derp" for R U R' might still be better for F2L, though, I admit. But I do think that at least for cross, it could be good, because that is more chaotic and it is memorized before executed.

I like this, but I would vote to move it to a new thread to discuss spoken notation.

I'd also like to note that HIJK is a really good, simple BLD system, and it would be nice not to have a conflict with K(=RUR').

 

[Ranzha]

I'm think of telling Nathaniel of thie HIJK thing. It's quite straightforward, as it assigns one letter per slot. I'm liking this idea. However, if doesn't solve basic edge control cases such as (R' F R F'), and for this reason I'll stick to my personal calling for those.

The tough thing I can imagine is calling OLLs. From my OLL page in the original post, there are some basic OLLs for the easier-to-execute cases we both know. Are there any defined systems to calling OLL?

 

[Toad]

2look.

 

[Yes We Can!]

Has anyone ever had this? You're solving, and your caller walks away without you noticing. When you realize you haven't had any calls for about 20 seconds you pull off the blindfold and everyone's laughing at you.
Conny @{

Lol XD, who was your caller?

Yeah, who was he? xD

 

[scylla]

what are the rules for team BLD?

 

[Sakarie]

what are the rules for team BLD?

http://www.speedsolving.com/wiki/index.php/Team_Blindfolded

I hope you enjoy taking the adventurous expedition to the Wiki before your next question!

 

[Ranzha]

Proposed regulations for Skype Team BLD:

So basically, here’s how it goes. You solve as you would in normal Team BLD, which I posted my proposed regulations for above.
Obviously, it’s unofficial. There is no event, no judges, no main judges. Please use your own discretion to decide the outcomes of solves and such. No one likes liars.
Here’s how it goes:
--Skype is opened.
--Both people sign in, and each have a cube of their own to use.
--A Skype call is initiated, without webcam. Webcam may not be used for solving. It’s not necessary. Personally, I think it gets in the way.
--The executor copies a scramble from qqTimer (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/922195/qqTimer.html or other sister sites) or a scramble-providing timer which does not display what the scramble looks like.
--The team scrambles their cubes and run a quick check of the validity of the scramble (such as, “Is there a green-orange in UF?”). In the event that the scrambles are wrong, the executor must provide a new scramble.
--The executor dons the blindfold.
--The team has fifteen seconds to inspect (discretion of the dictator).
--The caller and executor may exchange verbal notes during the inspection phase.
--The executor starts the timer and performs the opening moves.
--The dictator applies the opening moves to his cube and dictates the solve step-by-step to the executor.
--It is the responsibility of the team to settle algorithm disputes and codes.
--When the cube is supposedly solved, the executor stops the timer and takes off the blindfold.
--If the cube is solved, it’s a success. If else, consult Article 10 in the WCA regulations (http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/regulations/).
--At any point may a scramble be repeated, but only once, if the executor wishes to become the dictator and vice versa. The better of the two results from the single scramble is the final time.

Now I'll segue into something supacool.

Nathaniel and I just got a 45.32 average of 5 on Skype Team BLD.

[9:54:18 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: R D2 U2 B2 F D B R2 F2 R B L' R' F2 D' F' L' F L' D' R L F2 R' U'
[9:56:18 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: 46.77.
[9:56:19 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: D F B2 L' D2 F2 D2 L B' D F2 R B' U D B' R U' R' B2 F2 R' L2 D2 L2
[9:58:22 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: 45.39.
[9:58:27 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: R B2 U2 D2 R2 U2 F D2 B' F' D' U' R' B2 R F2 D' F2 D' F U2 L R' U D.
[10:00:50 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: 43.33.
[10:01:04 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: R' L2 F2 D2 L2 U' B D' F' L B2 R2 D U2 R' L2 U' F R2 L2 F' U B2 R2 B.
[10:03:46 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: 1:14.96
[10:04:00 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: R F L2 R' U F U D' L' D' R' L B2 U2 B' R2 F' D2 F' B' L2 D' R2 B' D'
[10:05:55 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: 43.80.
[10:06:02 PM] Ranzha Vliefodo Emodrach: current avg5: 45.32 (σ = 1.22)

Nathaniel dictated, and I executed.
Remember, this is over Skype. Too bad there's no film. D=