Recognition between COLL and OLL

[Neutrals01]

Hmm....have a question to ask. Currently I had learned all PLL but havent start learning any OLL except for the corner orient and edge orient. But somehow my recognition for PLL is quite slow, so since I havent started OLL.. Because when I thought of learning OLL, I think..57 cases OLL to recognize + 21 cases PLL to recognize..but COLL only 40 cases and with the remaining 4 epll is near to 0 sec recognition. Since I havent master the recognition for PLL, so compare OLL and COLL, which is easier to master the recognition? Need comments pls. thx.

 

[hawkmp4]

Well, with OLL/PLL you have two steps. without some sort of edge control, your last layer will be EO, COLL, EP... an extra step. And I think that COLL is harder to recognize than PLL anyway. Just practice PLL some more.

 

[nitrocan]

you might not always run into a COLL case. learn PLL, OLL then COLL.

 

[somerandomkidmike]

In my opinion, it is much easier to master the recognition of OLL. Also you have to consider that with COLL the edges have to be oriented properly. Learning the 57 algorithms isn't as big of a task as you might think.

 

[Speedy McFastfast]

I know somebody who used to do COLL then PLL of edges (Petrus method) but then switched to OLL/PLL. Know why? OLL is easier. More cases, but faster.

 

[waffle=ijm]

yup yup OLL/PLL is faster.
unless you match it up with Guus Razoux Schultz's method COLL/EOLL
which gets about the same times at the full OLL/PLL...i think

 

[LarsN]

I know somebody who used to do COLL then PLL of edges (Petrus method) but then switched to OLL/PLL. Know why? OLL is easier. More cases, but faster.

I did that! I chose COLL because of the fewer alg count. But I regretted and switched to OLL/PLL. I do use COLL when I get an OLL case with edges oriented.

I don't find COLL harder to recognize, but for most cases the OLL algs are shorter and faster.

 

[Neutrals01]

Hmm...if OLL and PLL, which is easier to master?

 

[StachuK1992]

Hmm...if OLL and PLL, which is easier to master?

rephrase?
msg too short

 

[Johannes91]

I know somebody who used to do COLL then PLL of edges (Petrus method) but then switched to OLL/PLL. Know why? OLL is easier. More cases, but faster.

What? OLL in Petrus method has only 7 cases.

 

[yurivish]

Does anyone have any opinions (preferably based on practice) on whether COLL/EPLL or OLL/PLL is faster with all edges oriented?

I thought that in theory, COLL+EPLL should be faster since you get easy cycles at the end, and the 1/12 chance of a skip. But in practice doing OLL and PLL seems faster to me. However, I only know 4 cases of COLL so far, and haven't practiced the algorithms for it as much as I have the OLL cross cases.

 

[Neutrals01]

Hmm...if OLL and PLL, which is easier to master?

rephrase?
msg too short

hmm...means that OLL (57 cases <short algorithm>) , PLL (21 cases <long algorithm>). Is it easier to master OLL or is it easier to master PLL?

 

[Speedy McFastfast]

I know somebody who used to do COLL then PLL of edges (Petrus method) but then switched to OLL/PLL. Know why? OLL is easier. More cases, but faster.

What? OLL in Petrus method has only 7 cases.

Wow, I really wasn't thinking when I said that. OLL is easier but has more cases when you do Fridrich. I think my mind was slipping back to Fridrich when I posted that... time to go smash my head into a wall, haha.

 

[AvGalen]

I know somebody who used to do COLL then PLL of edges (Petrus method) but then switched to OLL/PLL. Know why? OLL is easier. More cases, but faster.

What? OLL in Petrus method has only 7 cases.

You know better Johannes! This is simply incomplete info. Petrus does Edge OLL (actually entire edge orientation) at a different stage. That doesn't mean there are no cases!

But it's true that for the final last layer stage Petrus has only 7 cases. (That's why COLL is often recommended for Petrus).

 

[Kenneth]

Does anyone have any opinions (preferably based on practice) on whether COLL/EPLL or OLL/PLL is faster with all edges oriented?

With edges up nothing (but ZB) is faster than COLL, that's an average of about 18 turns and recognition for EPLL is fast, faster than it needs to be in many cases because you can often see the EPLL before COLL is ended.

I think I can average about 5 seconds for COLL/EPLL on a good day, still I'm a 25-30 seconds cuber.

 

[AvGalen]

Hmm...if OLL and PLL, which is easier to master?

rephrase?
msg too short

hmm...means that OLL (57 cases <short algorithm>) , PLL (21 cases <long algorithm>). Is it easier to master OLL or is it easier to master PLL?

[Pochmann mode]Define master[/Pochmann mode]

 

[Kenneth]

Nice tag Arnaud, I think I will use it too... You can also use [Kenneth mode]then doa lots off typs[/Kenneth mode] and the text will become fully readable no matter your bad typing

 

[AvGalen]

[Kenneth mode]I k b e n h e e l e r g b e n i e u w d n a a r h e t r e s u l t a a t. E n i k b e n o o k b e n i e u w d h o e v e e l l o t s o f f t y p s i k p r e c i e s n o d i g h e b e n o f h e t r e s u l t a a t n e d e r l a n d s o f e n g e l s w o r d t[/Kenneth mode]

 

[Johannes91]

OLL in Petrus method has only 7 cases.

You know better Johannes! This is simply incomplete info. Petrus does Edge OLL (actually entire edge orientation) at a different stage. That doesn't mean there are no cases!

There are only 7 (or 6 or less, depending on how you count) different cases for orienting the last layer. If it's not clear what I meant then too bad, I'm neither interested nor good at English.

But it's true that for the final last layer stage Petrus has only 7 cases.

What's "final last layer stage"?

 

[AvGalen]

OLL in Petrus method has only 7 cases.

You know better Johannes! This is simply incomplete info. Petrus does Edge OLL (actually entire edge orientation) at a different stage. That doesn't mean there are no cases!

There are only 7 (or 6 or less, depending on how you count) different cases for orienting the last layer. If it's not clear what I meant then too bad, I'm neither interested nor good at English.

But it's true that for the final last layer stage Petrus has only 7 cases.

What's "final last layer stage"?

Don't hide behind your English Johannes. It's better than most others on this forum.

And I simply messed up with that "final last layer stage". That should have been "final orient last layer stage".