Edge orientation: COLL or WV?

[rubiknewbie]

For people who do edge control with last slot, do you compare your timing when you use COLL vs Winter Variation?

At the last slot, there are 2 choices:
1. ZBF2L/VHF2L to fix edges followed by COLL (or even ZBLL which is beyond me at this point!) then EPLL.

2. Do intuitive VHF2L to the point where you can apply WV and skip OLL, followed by PLL.

However you have to choose 1 or the other, since doing WV will result in a random PLL and not doing WV result in a random OLL skip. Which would you choose?

Or another scenario would be you don't work for edge orientation with ZBF2L/VHF2L, but if the situation comes up where the edge is oriented by luck, and then you have to choose to go COLL path or WV path.

In your experience, which is more rewarding? It is guaranteed OLL skip vs the guranteed EPLL. Has anyone ever compared?

 

[Gurplex2]

im faster at vhf2l than winter
(why is it called winter?)

 

[xXzaKerXx]

Definitely the OLL skip.

 

[irontwig]

imho VHF2L sucks, either orient edges earlier (ZZ or Petrus) or learn ZBF2L.

 

[nck]

imho VHF2L sucks, either orient edges earlier (ZZ or Petrus) or learn ZBF2L.

+1
imo vh is just 2look zbf2l

 

[Cride5]

(why is it called winter?)

It's named after its proposer - Lucas Winter. See [wiki]Winter Variation[/wiki]

 

[eastamazonantidote]

For people who do edge control with last slot, do you compare your timing when you use COLL vs Winter Variation?

At the last slot, there are 2 choices:
1. ZBF2L/VHF2L to fix edges followed by COLL (or even ZBLL which is beyond me at this point!) then EPLL.

2. Do intuitive VHF2L to the point where you can apply WV and skip OLL, followed by PLL.

In your experience, which is more rewarding? It is guaranteed OLL skip vs the guranteed EPLL. Has anyone ever compared?

Unfortunately your options are very different and I'm not sure you understand VHF2L. The point of VHF2L is to reduce the final F2L pair and the EO to R' F R F', R U R', or U R U' R'. The most common case is actually the R' F R F', which does not help with WV. That being said, your second option should be ZZ with WV. My vote is for COLL because recognition is much, much easier. It also leads into the holy grail of speedcubing.

imho VHF2L sucks, either orient edges earlier (ZZ or Petrus) or learn ZBF2L.

VHF2L isn't that bad. ZBF2L is like algorithmic F2L while VHF2L is like intuitive F2L. And in case you didn't notice, VHF2L is part of ZBF2L. And VHF2L takes roughly as long as EOLine, so don't think it's slow. Is it worth it? eh...that's a different question. But I am satisfied with the results.

 

[irontwig]

imho VHF2L sucks, either orient edges earlier (ZZ or Petrus) or learn ZBF2L.

VHF2L isn't that bad. ZBF2L is like algorithmic F2L while VHF2L is like intuitive F2L. And in case you didn't notice, VHF2L is part of ZBF2L. And VHF2L takes roughly as long as EOLine, so don't think it's slow. Is it worth it? eh...that's a different question. But I am satisfied with the results.

I think VHF2L is bad since it does in 4 looks (maybe 3.5 looks is more descriptive)what CFOP does in 3, namely last slot+LL and it doesn't do it more efficiently.
If you want to do ZBF2L intuitively you're imo better of doing the EO first , at least move wise, since the c/e pair restricts freedom too much. The best EO approach is probably doing it flexibly while doing the F2L, but that might be too hard to do fast.
VHF2L and EOLine taking the same amount of time sounds about right to me, but imo EOL does way more for the solve, especially if one doesn't know ZBLL.
Remember that all ZB does is eliminate OLL (apart from 1/72 when you get cases with no permutation), which is only ~8 moves, so you can't fudge around too much or else you won't save any time/moves.

 

[rubiknewbie]

For people who do edge control with last slot, do you compare your timing when you use COLL vs Winter Variation?

At the last slot, there are 2 choices:
1. ZBF2L/VHF2L to fix edges followed by COLL (or even ZBLL which is beyond me at this point!) then EPLL.

2. Do intuitive VHF2L to the point where you can apply WV and skip OLL, followed by PLL.

In your experience, which is more rewarding? It is guaranteed OLL skip vs the guranteed EPLL. Has anyone ever compared?

Unfortunately your options are very different and I'm not sure you understand VHF2L. The point of VHF2L is to reduce the final F2L pair and the EO to R' F R F', R U R', or U R U' R'. The most common case is actually the R' F R F', which does not help with WV. That being said, your second option should be ZZ with WV. My vote is for COLL because recognition is much, much easier. It also leads into the holy grail of speedcubing.

There are a few cases of VHF2L (like 4 out of 16 excluding mirrors) that lead to R U' R' insertion which gets you into Winter variation cases.

Actually that number increases to like 8 or more if you add moves but since adding moves is bad I ignore those.

 

[nck]

For people who do edge control with last slot, do you compare your timing when you use COLL vs Winter Variation?

At the last slot, there are 2 choices:
1. ZBF2L/VHF2L to fix edges followed by COLL (or even ZBLL which is beyond me at this point!) then EPLL.

2. Do intuitive VHF2L to the point where you can apply WV and skip OLL, followed by PLL.

However you have to choose 1 or the other, since doing WV will result in a random PLL and not doing WV result in a random OLL skip. Which would you choose?

Or another scenario would be you don't work for edge orientation with ZBF2L/VHF2L, but if the situation comes up where the edge is oriented by luck, and then you have to choose to go COLL path or WV path.

In your experience, which is more rewarding? It is guaranteed OLL skip vs the guranteed EPLL. Has anyone ever compared?

Why not muggles?

 

[4Chan]

I liek WV for some cases.
Some cases for WV are are pretty simple, you just do the sexy move before the slot maybe once, twice, three times, and you know 3 cases right there.

You should know the easy WV cases, and then use COLL when you get a bad case.