Another 4LLL

[Kenneth]

Normally a 4LLL is EOLL, C-OLL, CPLL and EPLL. This is ment to be a stepping stone for OLL/PLL = you can anytime exange any 2-group of steps with 1-2 = OLL and 3-4 = PLL. You can add upp cases to those you know and does not have to learn all at once if you like to go 2LLL.

But not all want's to go OLL/PLL. So I'm planning to make a set of algs that does C-OLL, CPLL, EOLL and EPLL as as stepping stone for CLL/ELL that would work the same as the "Fridrich" 4LLL.

It makes the same, it will be the same number of algs but you must change all EOLL to ones that does not change corners (MU) but on the other hand you can change C-OLL to ones that does not preserve edges (FRUR'U'F for example).

Great idéa? I think the cubing world really lacks that (or is it any pages that has this already, I have not seen any as I remember)

For you who knows how to do the rest and like to give it a try, here are my favorite EOLL's that preserves corners:

Two adjacent: M U M' U2 M U M'
Opposite: (x') M' U' R U M U' R' U (x)
All four: F2 M F2 U M2 U' B2 M B2 ... orient during the alg and do all F/U/B as U

Use you favorite OLL's for C-OLL and J/N-PLL for CPLL, EPLL is EPLL as always, if you are an experienced cuber you learn in 10 minutes...

Come on you fast guys, I like to see a sub 20 using this

 

[nitrocan]

i get sub20's once a day or so dont expect me to get it with these.
but here are my algs for those cases:

adjacent: the same as yours
opposite: R U R' U' M' U R U' Rw'
all four: M U R U R' U' M2 U' R U' R'

 

[philkt731]

My first 4LLL was EOLL, CPLL, C-OLL, EPLL

 

[rjohnson_8ball]

My last layer stages used to be in the order CPLL, COLL, EOLL, EPLL. Maybe 50% of the time I did EOLL and EPLL in one algorithm. It wasn't bad. Now I do a regular EOLL, COLL and one look PLL, but my last layer is not much faster than before.

 

[Crzyazn]

Soo....Im a terrible person for never learning 4LLL and jumping right to 3look?

 

[hawkmp4]

Soo....Im a terrible person for never learning 4LLL and jumping right to 3look?

So you never cubed between the time you learned your first PLL and the time you learned all 21?

 

[Crzyazn]

I used some kid's "personal" method which varied between 4-8 steps

 

[KConny]

Soo....Im a terrible person for never learning 4LLL and jumping right to 3look?

So you never cubed between the time you learned your first PLL and the time you learned all 21?

I didn't.

 

[Kenneth]

How hard is corner control to do?

Look at this: you can go from: C-OLL, CPLL, EOLL, EPLL (4LLL) to CC/C-OLL, CPLL+EOLL, EPLL (2LLL if CC else 3LLL)

It's like EC/EOLL, COLL, EPLL is to Fridrich but for CLL/ELL. CPLL+EOLL is 17 cases I think. If you do partial corner control and only do one of the LL corners with the last pair (wery easy), then you get 5 C-OLL's, 17 CPLL+EOLL's and 4 EPLL's, a total of 26 algs, much better than 3 EOLL's, 42 COLL's and 4 EPLL's = 49 algs.

But I think it will use a few turns more than COLL.

Example of CPLL+EOLL: M/M' J-PLL M/M'

 

[Kenneth]

How hard is corner control to do?

Look at this: you can go from: C-OLL, CPLL, EOLL, EPLL (4LLL) to CC/C-OLL, CPLL+EOLL, EPLL (2LLL if CC else 3LLL)

It's like EC/EOLL, COLL, EPLL is to Fridrich but for CLL/ELL. CPLL+EOLL is 17 cases I think. If you do partial corner control and only do one of the LL corners with the last pair (wery easy), then you get 5 C-OLL's, 17 CPLL+EOLL's and 4 EPLL's, a total of 26 algs, much better than 3 EOLL's, 42 COLL's and 4 EPLL's = 49 algs.

But I think it will use a few turns more than COLL.

Example of CPLL+EOLL: M/M' J-PLL M/M'

Fridrich cubers look at this:

1:27 you skip corner orientation, learning CPLL+EOLL is easy, the J-PLL cases that you solve using my example alg are the most common ones, end in EPLL. 1:8 times you also skip the edges orientation and that's a full OLL-skip, then do PLL. Else there are 3 cases where the corners are permuted, algs for those are above, for some cases you can use the OLL's that orients only edges you already know, try them and wach how corner permutation changes to see how/if they work.

Any one who got the energy to find algs for all cases? there are 3 permuted (we got algs for those), 5 diagonal and 7 adjacent ones (4 are done using MU-J-PLL) = 15 totally (2 of the 17 cases in CPLL+EOLL are PLL)

Recognition is almost instant, probably one of the fastest for any type of LL-method.

 

[Kenneth]

Was looking for some algs, found that in most cases exept the ones you can do using J-PLL are not easy so there is no point then, OLL/PLL is as good.

But this is still good to ease up the LL-situation when you got corners oriented and two adjacent edges to orient in OLL, Then use MU-J-PLL to solve OC and EO if you got two adjacent cornes to swap, else if the case is diagonal, then swap any two corners and do EO to get from the Y/V/F group to the J/G/R/A group of PLL's

You do not even have to learn anything, you already know J-PLL, only thing to do is to look at corner permutation if you got that OLL case and do MU-J-PLL instead of the OLL-alg.

Useful?

 

[mrCage]

Hi

You mean sub-20 for the 4LLL or a full solve using that lsat layer technique ?? I guess i know the answer anyway ...

My 4-look LL is like so:

1 - position corners
2 - orient corners
3 - solve ONE edge and leaving an edge 3-cycle, unless i know a direct solving algorithm already for all the edges.
4 - Final 3 edges 3-cycle

There's similar with edges done first, corners last.

These 4-step solutions do not so easily lead you into the full OLL + PLL :-S

Another option not often mentioned is PLL + OLL. Recognition for both of these steps is quite horrible i guess !!

- Per

 

[Kenneth]

Another option not often mentioned is PLL + OLL. Recognition for both of these steps is quite horrible i guess !!

F R U R' U' F' for Y-PLL, not bad! All four corners in the H-case OLL, minimum 16 HTM, really really bad!

But recognition for OLL can't be harder than it already is, it's the same patterns, but for PLL, it's not that easy with the pieces oriented...