[WCA Regulations 2012] Proposed New Event: Skewb

[JonnyWhoopes]

I haven't read this too intensively, so I'm curious as to what Dene means by "simple". Simple does not seem to have an intuitive definition when it comes to speedsolving.

 

[Dene]

-So the records are meaningless. Boo hoo. Speedcubing is about having fun and getting personal bests, not about getting the world record.

So what's the point of having a World Cube Association? Why bother going to all the time, cost, and effort of hosting competitions for people all the time? It seems like the more you're saying, the more you're completely undermining the existence of the WCA.

NOTE: This is my own view, and not necessarily the view of the WCA.

Because I believe that if it can be competitive, it's nice to have some kind of records? Your opinion I guess.

Jolly good. Well I just invented a new puzzle. It is completely unique, so I am the only one that possesses it and I don't want anyone other than my best friend and myself to solve it. We work hard to beat each others' times, so when we solve it we are competitive. Now I want to host my own puzzle as a new official event.

Yes, you seemingly just advocated my little scenario which I just made up. Now you see why it's silly?

I haven't read this too intensively, so I'm curious as to what Dene means by "simple". Simple does not seem to have an intuitive definition when it comes to speedsolving.

Simple in the sense that, due to the nature of the puzzle and the means needed to solve it, the solve time is very short. Whereas in comparison, a more complicated puzzle like square-1 or 3x3 could also be solved with very few algorithms or not much thought needed, but because of the nature of the puzzles, solving them in such basic ways is going to take more time in the vast majority of cases. With a puzzle like pyraminx, 2x2, or skewb, very few moves are needed to solve them, and this results in very low times. Even if basic methods are used like ortega (I couldn't quote you on the average move count of ortega) very fast times can be achieved.

I'm not sure if I got my point across clearly, hence my examples, but I don't know if they helped or not >.<

 

[asportking]

So what's the point of having a World Cube Association? Why bother going to all the time, cost, and effort of hosting competitions for people all the time? It seems like the more you're saying, the more you're completely undermining the existence of the WCA.

NOTE: This is my own view, and not necessarily the view of the WCA.

I was only referring to the single (and average, depending on the times) world record becoming meaningless. The records from individual competitions definitely aren't meaningless. For example, the 2x2 WR is pretty much meaningless because it was so lucky, but other records such as the 2x2 average WR aren't.

 

[Dene]

I was only referring to the single (and average, depending on the times) world record becoming meaningless. The records from individual competitions definitely aren't meaningless. For example, the 2x2 WR is pretty much meaningless because it was so lucky, but other records such as the 2x2 average WR aren't.

Hang on, I don't really understand what view you are supporting. You agree with me that the 2x2 single WR is meaningless, but you still feel that times that people get at individual competitions have meaning? To me I don't see how these are really separate things.

 

[asportking]

Hang on, I don't really understand what view you are supporting. You agree with me that the 2x2 single WR is meaningless, but you still feel that times that people get at individual competitions have meaning? To me I don't see how these are really separate things.

I'm starting to get a bit confused as well. What exactly do you mean by "meaningless?" I'm defining it as "an extremely lucky solve that doesn't really reflect on the cuber's actual talent," but you might be defining it as something different.

 

[Dene]

I'm starting to get a bit confused as well. What exactly do you mean by "meaningless?" I'm defining it as "an extremely lucky solve that doesn't really reflect on the cuber's actual talent," but you might be defining it as something different.

I'm referring to the entire event, not the one solve.

 

[Kirjava]

Seems like you don't want to discuss this point, so I thought I'd drag it up.

why do some random people manage to get comparably good times in those events when they are not exceptional at any other event?

Now you can address my question.

No need.

Maybe you didn't understand the point I was making, although I'm not sure why it wasn't clear, because the issue does not apply to most events. There aren't a bunch of random people with near WR bld solve times because of lucky solves, nor 4x4 or any other bigcube, nor OH; basically all the more challenging events. Even if some nub gets a lucky solve they will never be able to compete with the WR times in those events.

I don't see how the issue only applying to certain events changes it's validity.

I said that the points you are making also apply to some of the existing events. (Therefore until there is a serious movement to remove these events the complaints you have are invalid.)

Then you said that they only apply to some of the existing events.

You're right, I don't understand the point that you were making.

 

[Dene]

Perhaps I misunderstood your point, but I've said all along that I think it also applies to other events, namely, 2x2, magics, pyraminx, and I think those events should be removed.

 

[tx789]

What happened when 6x6 and 7x7 were added and how did people feel

 

[Kirjava]

Perhaps I misunderstood your point, but I've said all along that I think it also applies to other events, namely, 2x2, magics, pyraminx, and I think those events should be removed.

The point is that as long as those events are part of the WCA (and lets be honest, they're not going anywhere anytime soon), any complaints put against Skewb as a new event that also apply to existing events are invalid.

 

[Dene]

I don't see why those complaints are invalid, it just means that the WCA really needs to sort itself out and come up with a more specific philosophy which dictates the sorts of events it wants to hold.

 

[MaeLSTRoM]

I don't see why those complaints are invalid, it just means that the WCA really needs to sort itself out and come up with a more specific philosophy which dictates the sorts of events it wants to hold.

It pretty much does:
The goal of the World Cube Association is to have more competitions in more countries with more people and more fun, under fair conditions.

You could say from this that the WCA would like to hold all events, if not for competition, then for fun.

 

[Dene]

It pretty much does:
The goal of the World Cube Association is to have more competitions in more countries with more people and more fun, under fair conditions.

You could say from this that the WCA would like to hold all events, if not for competition, then for fun.

And yet in the 5 years that I've been around only 2 events have been added (at the same time, and for exactly the same reason), and Tyson, as I recall (I may be wrong) opposed it.

 

[Kirjava]

I don't see why those complaints are invalid

If the WCA is already holding these events, it has no problem with holding events with these 'complaints'.

The things that you are posting would be better suited in a new thread you should make about removing events.

 

[TimMc]

Some simple questions:

1. What's gods number for a Skewb?
2. How many moves on average does it take for most speedcubers to solve a Skewb?
3. What's a decent solve time for a Skewb?

Tim.

 

[Kirjava]

Some simple questions:

1. What's gods number for a Skewb?
2. How many moves on average does it take for most speedcubers to solve a Skewb?
3. What's a decent solve time for a Skewb?

Tim.

1) 11
2) Don't know.
3) 7

 

[Carrot]

Some simple questions:

1. What's gods number for a Skewb?
2. How many moves on average does it take for most speedcubers to solve a Skewb?
3. What's a decent solve time for a Skewb?

Tim.

1. 11
2. 28, 25, 22, 21, 18, 24, (16), 26, (31), 17, 21, 19 => 22.10 (funny, because I guessed it would be 22)
3. 7
   

 

[Sa967St]

2. How many moves on average does it take for most speedcubers to solve a Skewb?
3. What's a decent solve time for a Skewb?

2. ~18-19 for me

Spoiler

number of solves: 100/100
best: 12
worst: 24
best avg5: 15.00 (σ = 0.82)
best avg12: 16.00 (σ = 1.67)
current avg100: 18.60 (σ = 2.97)

(I didn't get any optimal solves.)

3. 6-7

 

[ZincK_NOVA]

Jolly good. Well I just invented a new puzzle. It is completely unique, so I am the only one that possesses it and I don't want anyone other than my best friend and myself to solve it. We work hard to beat each others' times, so when we solve it we are competitive. Now I want to host my own puzzle as a new official event.

Yes, you seemingly just advocated my little scenario which I just made up. Now you see why it's silly?

Well this is a major exaggeration, it seems like you're failing to understand what I mean. For starters, if your example was the case, you and your friend would be the only two competitors therefore moderation would be very easy and probably require no other recognition of reliability than your friend and yourself. Skewb is a puzzle that is solved by a considerable amount of people from around the world who may not all have the ability to contact eachother. They're going to require some form of database which is accessible by all and moderated by an independent board (to ensure no cheating etc.). I guess I just thought it'd be convenient if this independent moderator was the same as the one for most other twisty puzzles.
Second point, why do you keep using the word "silly"? It is very ambiguous and has already led to some confusion, could you please be more literate?

 

[Meep]

Some simple questions:

1. What's gods number for a Skewb?
2. How many moves on average does it take for most speedcubers to solve a Skewb?
3. What's a decent solve time for a Skewb?

Tim.

2. 19, 12(Lucky), 17, 17, 12, 18, 6(Lucky), 6(Lucky), 16, 16, 19, 6(Lucky) -> 13.67
3. Sub-8