Derrick Eide17
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Meow
Stefan Pochmann?????
- Thread starter Jojobobo
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Weston
Premium Member
He's a really cool guy in person.
I met him and we discussed BLD a little bit at nationals.
I met him and we discussed BLD a little bit at nationals.
AvGalen
Premium Member
It is not supposed to be funny. It is supposed to point out the stupidity of the question and make the topicstarter think about how he could improve.
The golden rule you talk about is very true. But Stefan would actually like to be treated that way IF he were to do something stupid like that.
Newbies should lurk around the forum and learn how it works before they start making posts (I did). They should also know about the forum rules and how to find information that has already been posted here (search, wiki, scrolling through the history pages of a subforum) before they start making posts.
Again, Stefan is actually guiding people to become better forummers, smarter people and more valuable cubing community members.
The problem is that Stefan is used to communicate with people that are well trained, smart and older. His style of communicating actually works well with people like that and that is one of the reasons why he is so well respected. He has realised that his style doesn't work well with "young, dumb, 'I have a question and want my answer now'" kind of people and that is one of the reasons he has chosen to actually change his tone somewhat. The quality of his responses is extremely high and he has seriously improved speedcubing in many ways.
Finally I would like to say that meeting Stefan in real life is always a pleasure.
Sin-H
Veteran
I've always had to giggle about Stefan's posts, especially when he once said to me "you must have no life" xD
about that answering-to-noobs-stuff: I also think it's fun
they get their answers anyway soon enough. I guess this could also be the reason why German is the only language having a word for something like "Schadenfreude" [laughing when something bad happens to other people] ^^
maybe he's just a bitter man in his midlife crisis who has read way too much of Douglas Adams and Terry Pratchett? just kidding, of course
Stefan stays Stefan and it's good this way
I'm looking forward to meeting him this weekend
about that answering-to-noobs-stuff: I also think it's fun
they get their answers anyway soon enough. I guess this could also be the reason why German is the only language having a word for something like "Schadenfreude" [laughing when something bad happens to other people] ^^maybe he's just a bitter man in his midlife crisis who has read way too much of Douglas Adams and Terry Pratchett? just kidding, of course
Stefan stays Stefan and it's good this way
I'm looking forward to meeting him this weekend
DavidWoner
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AvGalen
Premium Member
I don't know about "most", but there doesn't have to be a relation between high post counts and being respected. A lot of my posts are (meant to be) humorous and are not really contributing to the knowledgebase that this forum is.
But people like
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/member.php?u=2928,
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/member.php?u=176 and
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/member.php?u=163
have "low" post counts
Ton
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I would not normally discuss people on a forum.
But if you know Stefan contributions are to the speedcubing community , you would be embarrassed by this question.
About his comments, Stefan will react if you make statements/conclusions that does not have any or lack foundation. I guess he tries people to learn to make distinctions between an opinion, make conclusion and make statements, so think twice before you post. Any way that is what I think and is not a fact as I am not Stefan.
any way your homework is:
What does Stefan do/did for the speedcuing community?
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Spitfire97
Regular
BLD
I wasn't attacking Stefan as a person or his contributions to the community or his cubing knowledge. I don't know him in person, but yes, I have heard lots of nice things about how he is in person many many many times in this forum, and I have no doubts about how nice a person he is in real life. But that wasn't what I was talking about. I don't think anyone is denying his contributions to the community or his cubing knowledge either. But that wasn't what I was talking about. It's the way he carries himself in this forum, that's what I was talking about. For the vast majority of us who have never met him in person, and never will in our lifetime, his behavior on the forum really speaks almost nothing about how he is in real life.
Say whatever you want about how he made you learn things, how he inspired you, how he made you a better person, and so on. But you cannot deny the fact that it is easily possible to make someone learn things and to inspire someone and to make someone a better person in a MUCH nicer way. There are lots of people like this around here, Chris Hardwick is one excellent example. If both Chris's approach and Stefan's approach help people learn things, why not use the nicer approach that even people who don't know them can appreciate? We all know that "everybody loves Stefan." I love Stefan too. But we all know that that statement only applies to people who've been around long enough to know the real Stefan. I think I can very safely say that most newbies' initial "feel" of Stefan would be negative, and maybe neutral at best.
Consider...
"Alright, alright, I'll be more constructive, [insert set of instructions for newbie to think about/reflect upon]"
... versus...
"Very good, I see you've given some thought about the subject; however, you seem to have missed something, have you ever considered [insert whatever]?"
It's obvious. Both help people learn, only the latter does so in a much more likeable manner. It really isn't that much harder to be nice.
Stefan is setting a bad example. Some people are rude and try to act like Stefan because they think it's funny. But the fact is, only Stefan can act the way Stefan acts and gain almost full approval from the community, and it really isn't justified. Of course, it's not really Stefan's fault that others are being rude, but you can't deny him being one of the contributing factors, however minor, to the negative atmosphere. Being a great figure in the development of cubing is one thing, portraying a positive image is another. You can't use one to justify the other. You just can't. And I'm sure we all know that.
Edit: I didn't mean to compare two great figures in the cubing scene so directly. It's just that Chris was the first person that came to my mind when it came to "knowledgeable and nice person."
Say whatever you want about how he made you learn things, how he inspired you, how he made you a better person, and so on. But you cannot deny the fact that it is easily possible to make someone learn things and to inspire someone and to make someone a better person in a MUCH nicer way. There are lots of people like this around here, Chris Hardwick is one excellent example. If both Chris's approach and Stefan's approach help people learn things, why not use the nicer approach that even people who don't know them can appreciate? We all know that "everybody loves Stefan." I love Stefan too. But we all know that that statement only applies to people who've been around long enough to know the real Stefan. I think I can very safely say that most newbies' initial "feel" of Stefan would be negative, and maybe neutral at best.
Consider...
"Alright, alright, I'll be more constructive, [insert set of instructions for newbie to think about/reflect upon]"
... versus...
"Very good, I see you've given some thought about the subject; however, you seem to have missed something, have you ever considered [insert whatever]?"
It's obvious. Both help people learn, only the latter does so in a much more likeable manner. It really isn't that much harder to be nice.
Stefan is setting a bad example. Some people are rude and try to act like Stefan because they think it's funny. But the fact is, only Stefan can act the way Stefan acts and gain almost full approval from the community, and it really isn't justified. Of course, it's not really Stefan's fault that others are being rude, but you can't deny him being one of the contributing factors, however minor, to the negative atmosphere. Being a great figure in the development of cubing is one thing, portraying a positive image is another. You can't use one to justify the other. You just can't. And I'm sure we all know that.
Edit: I didn't mean to compare two great figures in the cubing scene so directly. It's just that Chris was the first person that came to my mind when it came to "knowledgeable and nice person."
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Ton
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My thought because there is so much useless discussions , questions -my opinion- , when the weight of positive "contributions" of his forums is divided by the number of posts, I think it will be a declining line.
My opinion is that this forum should not discuss people/speedcubers or make statements about people.
In the end we have moderators , my advice to them is make a policy and make clear what the goal is of this forum. If I would be moderator the majority of the post about people will be delete.
My opinion is that this forum should not discuss people/speedcubers or make statements about people.
In the end we have moderators , my advice to them is make a policy and make clear what the goal is of this forum. If I would be moderator the majority of the post about people will be delete.
JTW2007
BattsMan
Agreed. To quote Stefan, "Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people."
oskarasbrink
Veteran
true (too short hmm ....)
That70sShowDude
Veteran
All of this is true, other people that I think of like Stefan include Lucas Garron and qqwerf
Why can't they just answer the question in a thread?
Now that I think about it, most of the high-skilled cubers are like this
Pretend there was an NBA forum where all of the best players had accounts. You would never see them bashing or making fun of their fans or other people not as good as them
I bet a lot of people stopped using the speedsolving forums because of the way a lot of people act around here
Bryan
Premium Member
When Stefan says "Yes", it's suppose to make the person think about the answer and realize they can find it on their own. When you're the newbie, you think, "Well, honestly, they could just take the time to show _me_ what needs to be done. After all, _I'm_ just _one_ new person." But it doesn't really work that way. If people take the time to help him by showing him exactly how to search, there's a chance that he doesn't actually learn how to apply it next time. When the next newbie comes along, they see someone got spoonfed by just asking questions without searching, and they ask. Now if they don't get spoonfed the answer, they get all crabby.
So the best is to just encourage people to be smart from the beginning. Stefan does that.
Chuck
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I agree. Honestly, Stefan is my role model in the way I take part on Indonesian online speedcubing forum. Not to mention that I would never get to know BLD without his simple yet effective method.
mazei
Veteran
I think the problem in that case is not the post Stefan made, but what the bunch of people posts after it. Especially if its something like 'owned' since well, you are a newbie, and imagine that that was your first post. Okay, this guy made a logical reply about my question being answerable, then after that it kinda seems like being bullied due to those other posts.
Stefan
Legend
True lolthread for me
Most of my comments also are in fact light-hearted, only rarely does someone really **** me off. I just try to be concise, thoughtful, entertaining and helpful, the latter admittedly often in a subtle way requiring the recipient to think. And I admit often my own entertainment comes first and the help second. I like Chris's friendly style, though I think often he's wasting a lot of time. Like those recent huge posts debating parity on a higher level with someone who stubbornly kept misunderstanding the basics. But yes, I'm trying to add "friendly" to my list of goals.
All that said, this "Yes" is an extreme example and I didn't do it often, though the underlying principles do guide much of my communication.
Which in turn was a quote from Eleanor Roosevelt, I think. And... while this thread is ostensibly about a person (me), I'd say it really is about certain behaviour and its perception. When I used that quote, it was about people obsessed with MonkeyDude to the extent that it seemed to be really about him rather than about what he was doing.
I actualy dislike most such "owned" comments, too, especially masses of them. I'm undecided about my simple "Yes". It's my way to say "If you're not willing to put some effort into this, then why should I?". Some people are just lazy and spoon-feeding them is a waste of time for us and not really helping them in the long run here or in life in general. Ideally, after a sufficient "Yes" nobody would post anymore until the inquirer returns asking for more details, in which case "Well, what do you know already?" might be the best response. I see it as a natural way making people realize how successful communication works. By showing them how poor communication doesn't. You can try telling them via rules and tutorials, but actively involving them is more effective, I believe.
Most of my comments also are in fact light-hearted, only rarely does someone really **** me off. I just try to be concise, thoughtful, entertaining and helpful, the latter admittedly often in a subtle way requiring the recipient to think. And I admit often my own entertainment comes first and the help second. I like Chris's friendly style, though I think often he's wasting a lot of time. Like those recent huge posts debating parity on a higher level with someone who stubbornly kept misunderstanding the basics. But yes, I'm trying to add "friendly" to my list of goals.
All that said, this "Yes" is an extreme example and I didn't do it often, though the underlying principles do guide much of my communication.
How do you know? (And how do you expect them to react when someone enters the forum with "Hi, please tell me how to throw a ball"?)
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That70sShowDude
Veteran
StefanPochmann said:
Actually, they probably wouldn't react that way even if that question was asked. It would probably only happen in speedcubing. People don't ask, "How do you turn a side?" in the forums here ...
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PEZenfuego
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grammar:fp
Stefan
Legend
Ok change it to "Hi, please tell me how to be good at free throws". And... you failed to answer the main question. Though I acknowledge you made a new statement reduced to "probably".
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