partial corner control

I was talking to Craig about partial corner control, and I find the whole concept to be very cool.

My question(s)

1) would it be worthwhile to start tinkering/learning it now, or should I wait until I get better at doing F2L in general, first? (right now for me a really good F2L time is about 22 seconds, whereas a real bad one could be up to 50 seconds)

2) are there any pages/tutorials which would help me figure it out?

let me know what you guys recommend

David

It might help to say something about what partial corner control is, for us unenlightened folk. Then maybe you'll get more input.

-Doug

Simultaneously orienting LL corners while solving the F2L, in an attempt to force a OLL skip.

Something similar is used for ZBF2L, although I dont know anything about it... I'm a newb -.-

David

In ZBF2L, the edges are oriented during the last F2L pair. Then you use ZBLL to orient the corners and permute all LL pieces simultaneously.

IMHO, at least intuitively, it is easier to orient edges than corners in the last F2L pair. There are only 2 possible orientations of each edge, vs. 3 for the corners.

-Doug

What about partial edge control?

Someone told me that it's easier...

just wondering.

David

Doug,

He got this Idea from me...I use partial corner control. ZBF2L is Complete edge control...I just try to prevent certain corner cases from happening...and sometimes I can influence an OLL skip (at least the corners).

Partial Corner control??? I'm sorry, but this idea is inane.

Why?

1) Recognition
2) More Cases
3) Pointless
4) EO control is just plain better
1) Recognition; isn't it obvious that observing edge orientation is easier.
2) There are more possible cases that occur, hence more cases to recognize to be fruitful with this method.
3) Pointless; Other than the occasional OLL skip you're not doing much for yourself. Partial Edge control is used to avoid the inherently worse OLL cases that can occur with no edges flipped. If you don't get an OLL skip with CO control, you've accomplished nothing extra. I don't think many OLL cases are much better or worse depending on CO.
4) by doing EO control you can flip all LL edges a reasonable amount of the time. This leaves you with 7 cases to deal with == awesome recognition. And the 7 cases that occur are inherently faster than most other OLLs.
---- ---- ----
How can CO be useful on a consistent basis? I'm glad you asked person with the same writing as me. It's simple. Orient all edges up to your 4th pair, and learn the shitload of cases there are for orienting all corners from that point. This might help you .0002% of the time.

Sorry to be so harsh but I want to snuff out this idea before it hurts any cubers.

If we want to be creative lets start looking into non-cfop ways to solve the cube. Its only fair...

lol...nice Richard, its true I know, but I'm just talking partial corner, to get the cases narrowed to 4-5 cases, so I never have to deal with the ones I don't like...

Craig

Originally posted by Cubefactor@Apr 9 2006, 09:28 AM
Partial Corner control??? I'm sorry, but this idea is inane.

Click to expand...

Eh.. Don't be too fast in your judgement... I don't think he's talking about full corner control..

I know someone who is working on a system that orients the LL pieces while inserting the F2L pairs... He calls it the OLL skip method. I think it might be quite feasable..

Btw, this reminds me of Ron making a note about Fridrich F2L when he saw it for the first time... 'Too hard to apply', it said.

But the full OLL skip method is quite a lot of algs isn't it? I'm thinking about orient the edges and then orient the corners with the last pair. So on the last pair you have already 3 edges orientet correctly, the problem is that you don't always got those 3 edges right and some cases are a bit hard to orient them fast... maybe my **** is bad anyway? I'm very interested in the OLL skip method by the way.

From what I understand, OLL skip method is just a few more algs compared to Fridrich. Maybe... 30% more algs or so? I am not sure...

nice, is 'the guy who is working on it' almost done?
I can't wait to try....