F2l+oll?

[magicsquares]

If there was a method that integrates the 4th F2L pair and OLL how many cases would there be? Or is it just not possible?

 

[Johannes91]

(2*3) * 58 + (2*3) * 216 + (2*3) * 216 + (8*3) * 216 = 8124

(2*3) * 58                   -- corner and edge in F2L
(2*3) * 216 + (2*3) * 216    -- one in LL, one in F2L
(8*3) * 216                  -- both in LL

 

[magicsquares]

Wow, that's a lot. I thought it was actually "possible" to make a method like that.

 

[masterofthebass]

There is, but it's not full OLL. It just gets the cross on top. It's called the ZB method and it has a ton of algorithms. Good Luck...

 

[Skrato]

@ magic squares - Yes there is and it is the ZB method. There are a little over 500 algs.

@ johannes91 - Your calculation is a little out

@ masterofthebass - the cross on top is the Vanderbergh-Harris method I think. And the only reason to learn this is to avoid OLL if you find identification of oll cases hard. The zb method orientates the ll while doing the last pair.


Go to Chris Hardwick's page for more about these methods, or search for the homepage

=)

 

[sam]

wrong. The zb method does not orient the entire LL while doing the last pair. it just has optimal algs for LL cases with each of the different edge orientations possible in the last layer. It only orients the edges of the last layer. VH is a more intuitive kind of alg. set that build the pair first then orients the edges in a sense while the last pair is still intact.
Please correct me, i dont really use these too much (Only some VH if i see i can skip oll by doing it).

 

[Johannes91]

@ johannes91 - Your calculation is a little out

Could you fix it? I don't see what's wrong.

 

[Swordsman Kirby]

A method that is currently splitting up to numerous cases is known as Makisumi-Garron Last Slot (MGLS for short). On the last pair, you insert the F2L edge while orienting edges, and then you insert the corner while orienting corners.

Of course, since the method has not been fully studied in detail, we are unsure of its effectiveness in comparison to "normal" Fridrich.

 

[Jason Baum]

@ masterofthebass - the cross on top is the Vanderbergh-Harris method I think. And the only reason to learn this is to avoid OLL if you find identification of oll cases hard. The zb method orientates the ll while doing the last pair.

It seems like there has been a lot of confusion about this lately. The ZB and VH methods both orient LL edges while solving the final F2L pair. The difference between the methods is that with VH, you first convert the pair into one of the basic three move insert cases, then solve the pair while orienting LL edges. With ZBF2L, you don't convert anything. You solve the pair as it is and orient LL edges. Essentially, VH is a simplified version of ZBF2L, since you first convert the pair into a three move insert and then use a ZBF2L alg. VHF2L has 32 cases, while ZBF2L has 306 cases. Also, VHLL typically is COLL + EPLL, which is 44 cases. ZBLL does everything in one step (orients corners, permutes edges, and permutes corners), and there are 494 algorithms in this step.

 

[Skrato]

Ah sorry about that post. I tried a zb alg once and it orientated the whole ll O.o

 

[alexc]

I think MGLS sounds like a good idea. How many cases would there be? If there are not too many and they can be recognized and executed quickly, it would be like having 4th F2L + easy OLL, which would probably be slightly faster than regular Fridrich.

 

[Dene]

Around 100-150 cases, depending on how you look at it. Check it out for yourself: Link

 

[Jason Baum]

Ah sorry about that post. I tried a zb alg once and it orientated the whole ll O.o

I believe there is a 1/27 chance of that happening with ZBF2L.