• Welcome to the Speedsolving.com, home of the web's largest puzzle community!
    You are currently viewing our forum as a guest which gives you limited access to join discussions and access our other features.

    Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community of 35,000+ people from around the world today!

    If you are already a member, simply login to hide this message and begin participating in the community!

Set-up moves

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
I am not good at set-up moves at all. Set-up moves is eating my time. Let's say I got a cycle of 3 with the corners. URB goes to ULF goes to DRF. I don't really know what to do. When I think of a way to do the set-up moves then my time goes. I use very long time, because the move count must be 5 moves max. because I must do it backward after that. Could someone help me with this problem? Is there a easy rule for this, so I don't lose it when I am going to do it backward?

This is just a problem I have for the permutation, not the orientation...
 

alexm

Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2006
Messages
6
Hey there. I know I don't post much (read: ever) but I thought I'd reply to this one.

I'd do something like D' R2 D R2 (cycle*) R2 D' R2 D

* Try it slowly and follow the corners while setting them up, you can see where they go and which cycle to do.
 

McWizzle94

Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
498
Location
A Place
WCA
2008CHAR03
YouTube
Visit Channel
Try this:

D-R2 D R2 D' R2 U2 R2 D R2 D' R2 U2-D'

The D sets it up at URB-->ULF-->DRB, the middle part is the cycle algorithm, and the D' returns it to how it was before the set up. You can also use the algorithm backwards to do that 3-cycle backwards.
 

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
Learn algs to cycle corners diagonally. All of the other cases you should be able to do easily. 2 setups at the most are required. Often times just one.
Is there a place to learn the algs? Or did you mean that I should find out by myself. I don't know if I know all the cases...

By the way, the only cases I use for Permutation is:
Edges:
3 cycle: U perm
2 cycle: Z & H perm

Corners:

3 cycle: Corner switcher both way.
2 cycle: H perm and the one that change the UF corners and UB corners (don't remember the name)

Thanks for those who answered my example, but my biggest problem is the edges. My examples was just to get you to understand what I meant.
 
Last edited:

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
Thanks! It will be easier with set-up moves for edges with those algs. You said max. moves for CP set-up is 2 moves without corners who must go diagonally, but could you (or anybody else) tell me the move count for EP?
 

Lucas Garron

Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2007
Messages
3,557
Location
California
WCA
2006GARR01
YouTube
Visit Channel
Thanks! It will be easier with set-up moves for edges with those algs. You said max. moves for CP set-up is 2 moves without corners who must go diagonally, but could you (or anybody else) tell me the move count for EP?
I can use one setup move at most for 3OP, both for EP and CP, and do so nearly all the time in actual execution.
(Excluding parity setups.)

For URF-ULF-DRF I would do Uy setup and R2'UL2'UR2U'L2'UR2'U2R2' for the alg.
(D' setup and the inverse of that alg, maybe.)

EDIT: Just tried a solve, and I used 2 setup moves total (EP+CP).
2 again...
3...
 
Last edited:

hait2

Member
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
251
U' R2 U R2 U F2 U' R2 U' R2 U F2

a very useful alg and very easy to remember (u' u => u' u' and always r2 r2 f2)
 

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
What about parity set-up moves? I think that's the biggest problem that I have concerning set-up moves.
 

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
The problem is to reverse the set-up moves. I can't remember what I did. Sometime I use long time before doing the set-up moves, so I am sure that I can reverse it correctly. But this takes too long. Also I am very close to forget what I have to remember. I have the same problem with 2-cycles, but I guess parity is harder...
 

Nghia

Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
74
WCA
2010DUON01
YouTube
Visit Channel
Hello Inusagi,

For corners I still use 3-cycles. For normal 3-cycles I know the usual algs plus the one hait2 talked about, the diagonal corners cycler.

CP(731): (R2'DR2D'R2-U2)x2
CP(375): (R2U'R2'UR2-D2')x2

(Courtesy from Macky's site)

Those have the same effect (if you have the same piece numeration as Macky) and I think they are quite easy to remember.

***

As for setup moves in general, I've read this somewhere and apparently you should try to follow an "order" like Left or Right moves before Front or Back moves, then Up or Down moves or something like that.
I personally don't use that but instead when I forget the setup moves, I just try to retrace the initial state of the cube (before the setup moves) and they will just come to my mind.
I guess the point of the whole thing is to practice, as everybody says.

(On my first attempts, I even had to remember the cube rotations and all -.- so I think you don't need to worry too much about it)

Voila, hope it helped you

Good Luck
 
Last edited:

Inusagi

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
606
I do the U/D then R/L then F/B turns if it's possible. But it doesn't work always.
 
Top