# PLL question...

#### pjk

Staff member
On the PLL step, what is a quick way to recognize which alg. to use? Many of the PLL algs look the same, it I find it tough to recognize which alg. to use in a timely manner. How long does it usually take you guys to do the PLL/OLL (in other words, how long does it take you to solve after F2L)? Thanks
Pat

#### CraigBouchard

##### Member
The good guys average anywhere from 4-6 for LL, and ranging F2Ls...

You get used to the cases, and it is all muscle memory. There is an easy way to recognize each case, if you want to know, just contact me.

#### pjk

Staff member

There is an easy way to recognize each case, if you want to know, just contact me.
Whats that?

#### Alexander

##### Member
My avg of 100 Last layers is around 6.30 sec
there are some 4 sec's and 8 sec;s also

#### Joël

##### Member
Hi Patrick,

My last layer takes about 6 seconds.. I would not be surprised if it's sub6 .

The way I recognise PLL, is used by a quite a few cubers... I always thought it was the 'only' way. I basically try to see 'blocks' of pieces that belong together, and I solve them first with U moves. Then I look at the patterns of the pieces, and the shape of their cycles (T permutation has two 'blocks', and two cycles: two corners have to be swapped, two edges have to be swapped).

After using this method a lot, you can recognise patterns faster, and also recognise the pattern without adjusting the U layer with U turns first. You might have to adjust the U layer after doing the PLL in that case.. For a lot of cases, I have recognition tricks, to see if I have to do a U, U2 or U' move after doing the PLL... I often recognise this in the middle of the PLL alg, but sometimes also before starting the PLL...

- Jo?l.

#### pjk

Staff member
Thanks for the replies. So after the F2L are complete, it takes you 2 algorithums max to solve it, right? 1 alg to OLL, and then 1 alg for PLL. Thanks
Pat

#### Joël

##### Member
Originally posted by PJK@Mar 21 2006, 11:57 PM
Thanks for the replies. So after the F2L are complete, it takes you 2 algorithums max to solve it, right? 1 alg to OLL, and then 1 alg for PLL. Thanks
Pat
Yes Patrick, you are right...

Have you seen my wonderful OLL page? A lot of ppl like it .

If you need any good PLL's, I have a list of my PLLs as well.. Just ask .

- Jo?l.