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Joe Biden(Obama's VP), hilarious mess-up

Hadley4000

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it was obviously planned.

ironic from a man that previous to a week ago had a great deal of positive things to say about John McCain and an enormous amount of bad things to say about Barack Obama.

Either way, I can't wait for him to snap again like he did in 1988. Or say something overtly racist (that will confuse a whole lot of folks).

And to answer the question earlier, there are people who will not vote for obama and don't like that he is black, and that's wrong and despicable, of course. But to be fair, he's really not losing any votes. Those people wouldn't vote for a socialist if he was alabaster, either.

At the end of the day, the fairytale and the coronation are going to be put on hold. He's falling further behind everyday (save this little convention bounce) in every key state. Conservatives (like myself) don't like John McCain because he is a moderate,but we can at least stand a principled conservative like Governor Palin. They'll vote for him and so will a great deal of moderates.

But no, when Obama loses it won't be because he is black. It will be because he ran on a platform that Americans won't stand behind. They greatest government miracle in history is the American people, the only free country that has fought the fallacy of socialism despite the golden tongues of statists like Obama, McGovern, and others.

Obama is currently 8 points ahead, and that was before McPain picked Sarah Palin.

She is going to kill him. I love it :)
 

Dene

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Communism is wrong no matter what "version" it is.

Just because something is great in theory, doesn't mean it works in practice. The only way in which communism equalizes people (as is the central idea behind it) is by making them all equally poor and powerless... while stealing their individual freedom and independence (both at the personal and economical level).
You obviously haven't read Bellamy's book. It is entirely practical, and (NOTE) there would no longer exist money in such a society. No one is poor, because no one has money. Power can be earned by anyone (and taken away by everyone). It is a society that works for the good of everyone, where no one ever has to worry about financial security, and no one has incentive to have heaps of possessions (i.e. no corruption).
One important thing is that it is still a democracy in a sense. The leaders are still elected for by the people at their level (and thus rise through the ranks as voted for by everyone). The leaders can also be stripped of power at an instance.
I certainly hope more people would seriously consider Bellamy's nationalism...
I'm sure this could work in practicality, it would just take the right nation to implement it.
 

Theron Rabe

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All communism is wonderful in theory.

However, no matter how good it looks on paper, it simply cannot work. People are naturally greedy beings that will always strive for more -- more possessions, more power, more everything. There is no possible way of convincing a person that they don't strive to have more.

In effect of natural greed, people also yearn to value themselves, and the people around them. A person can't find value in people without some form of currency (because what's a valuable trait to one person may not be valuable to someone with different beliefs). I should also mention that credit wouldn't work either (I'm assuming this is where you're going next, Dene... because I believe that's the idea behind Bellamy's system, if I remember correctly).

Credit doesn't work without a real, physical backing. Credit as it currently exists works because it is backed by money and physical assets. Without money, or (as you mentioned) no incentive for physical possessions, credit doesn't work. It doesn't work because it's not real; it's merely an idea.

I don't want to sound disrespectful to your ideas, Dene... because I must admit myself, your thoughts are wonderful... I just firmly believe that since communism doesn't work in practice, it's morally wrong to actually implement the principles of it.
 

immortalcube

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I'm not an american, but i've been watching larry king a lot. He has brought up the issue of race and how its going to affect obama's chances. So my question is why are there still Americans who will not vote for obama because he's black? I don't get it.

There are still many Americans (mostly in the South, no offense to those who aren't like this and live in the South however) who believe that the Caucasian race is above the African American race.
There's an entire other side to this as well. What about people who will vote Obama because he's black? Most of my black friends are going to/would (if they were older) vote for him, and many of them don't really know what his positions are on important issues, it's more like a popularity contest.

"And although it seems heaven sent
We ain't ready to see a black President
It ain't a secret don't conceal the fact
The penitentiary's packed, and it's filled with blacks
But some things will never change."
-Tupac (Changes)
Anyone else notice the irony? :eek:
 

qqwref

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No one is poor, because no one has money.
I can't agree with this. Poverty in this case isn't about how much money someone has but their quality of life, and in many of the communist countries that have already existed the overall quality of life has been very low. A communist country might only have one financial class, but people in that country can compare themselves to capitalist countries to find out which of their classes they seem to belong in, and whether they live the equivalent of a rich or poor lifestyle is based on the wealth of the country. Of course, without any real incentives to work as hard as possible to help the country (it doesn't matter if you get fired because you aren't making any money anyway), many people will not work as much as they would under a capitalist government, and the overall production of the country seems likely to end up so low that everyone actually does end up being 'poor' by the standards of other developed countries.
 

Dene

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People are naturally greedy beings that will always strive for more -- more possessions, more power, more everything. There is no possible way of convincing a person that they don't strive to have more.
That is quite a claim, many would disagree. Plus, what more could someone want than utopia? Also, if they want power, then they can work hard and achieve it, the same as in capitalism. (Intellectual power can also be accomplished).
In effect of natural greed, people also yearn to value themselves, and the people around them. A person can't find value in people without some form of currency (because what's a valuable trait to one person may not be valuable to someone with different beliefs). I should also mention that credit wouldn't work either (I'm assuming this is where you're going next, Dene... because I believe that's the idea behind Bellamy's system, if I remember correctly).
I could go down the road of credit, that is effectively how it would work. And commenting on Mr. Gottlieb: there is incentive to work, without it you don't get the credit.
One thing that Bellamy mentions is this: when questioning whether people will not find value without money, he makes an analogy to the military. You see people doing all sorts of acts of "heroism" and crazy stuff like that, and for what? Pride, basically. And that same incentive can be put towards the general workforce etc.
Credit doesn't work without a real, physical backing. Credit as it currently exists works because it is backed by money and physical assets. Without money, or (as you mentioned) no incentive for physical possessions, credit doesn't work. It doesn't work because it's not real; it's merely an idea.
There are physical assets though. The assets are effectively worthless, but they're still there. Overseas exchange would stimulate the economy though.
I don't want to sound disrespectful to your ideas, Dene... because I must admit myself, your thoughts are wonderful... I just firmly believe that since communism doesn't work in practice, it's morally wrong to actually implement the principles of it.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion! I just hope more people can embrace equality.
 
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