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Is Clock a twisty puzzle? 15 Puzzle?

Do Clock and/or 15 Puzzle qualify as twisty puzzles?

  • Clock: No; 15 Puzzle: Yes

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Clock: Undecided; 15 Puzzle: Yes

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Clock: Yes; 15 Puzzle: Undecided

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Clock: No; 15 Puzzle: Undecided

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    48

illius

Member
Joined
Apr 20, 2015
Messages
138
Location
London, UK
WCA
2015VIRJ01
I am filming a documentary (as part of a course at my educational institution), on the History of Twisty Puzzles. I would first like to define a twisty puzzle, and give definite examples of what do (e.g. 7x7x7), and do not (e.g. Jigsaw) fit the definition. I would then like to talk about the puzzles with which there is much controversy, over whether they match the definition.

I hence chose to talk about clock and 15 puzzle, as two good examples, as both of them are fairly well known, they both involve some form of twisting, and there have been discussions before regarding these puzzles.

I shall most probably publish the results in the documentary, and I also may read out/show a picture of individual statements. Therefore, by submitting an opinion here, you agree that I may screenshot your post, and the surrounding area. Where applicable, I might also give some information of you (e.g. xxx is the world champion for yyy). Should you wish to remain anonymous, please specifically and explicitly state this in your post. If you do not do this, I shall assume that you do not wish to remain anonymous.

Thank you very much.
 

TDM

Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2013
Messages
7,009
Location
Oxfordshire, UK
WCA
2013MEND03
YouTube
TDM028
I don't know how a clock works since I've never used one, but I know 15 puzzle is definitely not a twisty puzzle. There's no twisting or turning involved; it's sliding.
 

megaminxwin

Current Clock NR Holder
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Messages
575
WCA
2010MACA01
Neither. 15 Puzzle for the same reasons that TDM said.

Clock is slightly more interesting, but I wouldn't say it's a twisty puzzle as you're not actually twisting anything. It's completely different functionally to all other twisty puzzles, like the Pyraminx or Skewb. The goal is not aligning colours, but arranging all the clocks to 12. It's a different kind of puzzle, but I couldn't say what kind exactly.

Source: I'm the Oceanic record holder for Clock single and average.

Also I'll only let you say who I am if we get to see the documentary, otherwise no.
 

Myachii

Member
Joined
May 24, 2014
Messages
884
Location
England
WCA
2013MORR03
YouTube
UCX4LzNj0n6Pq1VfAjg
15 Puzzle is definitely not.

For Clock however, it is a WCA event, and WCA stands for World Cube Association. The Pyraminx isn't cube shaped yet it is still labelled as a cube, therefore I think that all WCA events are twisty puzzles.

I agree with megaminxwin, on the Clock you don't need to match colours, but I still think it is a twisty puzzle because you can twist the clocks using the gears, there are multiple combinations of different twists you can do (thanks to the pins) and the overall objective is to make all clocks face the same way (similar to matching all the colours)

Mirror blocks are technically a twisty puzzle, and you don't have to match colours on that. So why shouldn't Clock be one too?
 

bcube

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2010
Messages
220
"Is Clock a twisty puzzle? 15 Puzzle?"

As you already stated, it depends on the definition of the term "twisty puzzle".

If in doubt, any reason not to use more general term, such as combination puzzle?
 
Last edited:

qqwref

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
7,830
Location
a <script> tag near you
WCA
2006GOTT01
YouTube
qqwref2
Clock and 15 puzzle are definitely not twisty puzzles. If you ask me a twisty puzzle is a 3-dimensional puzzle where moves are made by rotating some set of pieces around a single axis (which may have side effects, such as with geared puzzles). In a 15-puzzle all the moves are translations and not rotations, and in clock pieces do not rotate around any common axis, they each rotate separately while staying in the same relative position.
 

cashis

Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
907
Location
louisiana
If we include clock in the WCA events and its not a "twisty" puzzle, why cant 15 puzzle be included too?
I think its time the WCA expand to other puzzles. after all, there are only so many original twisty puzzles that are significantly different from each other. The only reason clock is in there at all is because it has the Rubiks name on it, so why not include other non twisty puzzles
or remove clock to keep it consistent.
 

qqwref

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
7,830
Location
a <script> tag near you
WCA
2006GOTT01
YouTube
qqwref2
If we include clock in the WCA events and its not a "twisty" puzzle, why cant 15 puzzle be included too?
I think its time the WCA expand to other puzzles. after all, there are only so many original twisty puzzles that are significantly different from each other. The only reason clock is in there at all is because it has the Rubiks name on it, so why not include other non twisty puzzles
or remove clock to keep it consistent.
Not relevant to this thread, but, the WCA has never really been about twisty puzzles, and the 15 puzzle would be a stupid puzzle to compete on because there are no really good physical versions of it and most of the serious competition on it (what little there is) has been on computer versions of it.
 

cashis

Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
907
Location
louisiana
Not relevant to this thread, but, the WCA has never really been about twisty puzzles, and the 15 puzzle would be a stupid puzzle to compete on because there are no really good physical versions of it and most of the serious competition on it (what little there is) has been on computer versions of it.
Yeah, guess it isnt relevant. Whoops. But I think good physical 15 puzzles would be made if it was a WCA event, like skewb.
Maybe I'm biased tho because I really enjoy 15 puzzle :)
 

molarmanful

Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2014
Messages
393
Location
Smerbia
WCA
2015PANG02
YouTube
molarmanful
Not relevant to this thread, but, the WCA has never really been about twisty puzzles, and the 15 puzzle would be a stupid puzzle to compete on because there are no really good physical versions of it and most of the serious competition on it (what little there is) has been on computer versions of it.
You should see my 15 puzzle speed mod. I'll probably make a video on it soon.

Basically, I took a plastic 15 puzzle, rounded the corners of each tiles, lubed like crazy, and BOOM! Amazing (physical) 15 puzzle that could have been made by Moyu. It even corner cuts!
 
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