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How Reconstructions are Treated on the Forum

Noahaha

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Does anyone even look at reconstructions?

I know that Bresty likes to show off occasionally, but I've seen way too many times where people beg for reconstructions, when it doesn't even seem like they would be useful.

Reconstructions are meant for learning.

I have several proposals/ideas that might be useful:

1. Only ask for a reconstruction when you think it would HELP you, not just when you think it would be COOL. It seems like people are asking for their solves to be reconstructed as a sort of badge of honor. Here's an idea: RECONSTRUCT IT YOURSELF. It's really not hard at all, especially if you were the one who did the solve. Just rescramble the cube, and try to figure out what you did. If you can't do it just based on the scramble, then try to figure it out from the video.

2. When you see a reconstruction, USE IT! It is an extremely good way to learn, and I don't think many people are taking advantage of it. A while back Brest reconstructed a 3x3 avg5 I did without me asking. As a result I ended up changing a few OLLs and learning some new ways to solve pairs. You can also learn a LOT of tricks from reconstructions of really fast people. When I was starting out, I took a lot of my 3-cycles from reconstructions of Marcell's 3BLDs.

3. Only ask for a reconstruction when you think you could BENEFIT from it. It seems like a lot of people present the attitude of "Brest should reconstruct this so that I can admire the fact that he reconstructed it." That's a very ridiculous stance. If Brest wants to do a reconstruction that no one will look at, he can, but when people ask for it, it shows that they think Brest is there to entertain them.

4. Let's TALK ABOUT the reconstructions. I know that Brest is sometimes frustrated by a lack of feedback about reconstructions. I will admit to being guilty of this. Talking about reconstructions can probably benefit the community in the same way that talking about chess games is extremely beneficial to chess players. Learning to understand another solver's decision making process can really help you out with your own.

5. If you REALLY want a reconstruction of someone else's solve, TRY DOING IT YOURSELF. Brest might be the best, but he certainly isn't the only one who could do it. Maybe you'll find that you like it!


Hopefully we can both be more considerate of Brest, and try to learn more from reconstructions going forwards.
 

Kit Clement

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:tu

For example: unless someone has the memory of Maskow, what good does reconstructing a 35/35 MBLD give us? The individual cubes aren't being done particularly fast if you're interested in 3BLD, and I don't think anyone's even close to being on the level of solving 35 cubes blind for a reconstruction to be useful. It's a wonderful achievement, but especially considering the time invested in reconstructing 35 cubes, it doesn't need to be reconstructed just because it's a WR. I'd rather see 35 3BLD solves reconstructed.

Also, reconstructing people who aren't necessarily the best can be just as informational to many. It's not a badge of honor, just like Noah said. It can give us insights into what others at similar speeds are doing and help target what we can be practicing.
 

Tim Major

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You basically said exactly what I feel, as I said here: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?44169-WR-Maskow-MBLD-35-35&p=906075&viewfull=1#post906075

I feel reconstructions are useful for SOME things (for example, Feliks' 6.8 average of 12) and also useful for your own solves.

However Brest does not have some special power. Everyone can reconstruct so stop making him do everything!

Fortunately, Brest enjoys reconstructing, but people requesting it for everything ever is pointless.

Edit: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?43496-Chinese-NR-Wang-Yi-3-94-pyraminx-average&p=888627&viewfull=1#post888627
For example, when a new method is being used, reconstructions are very helpful, and people would actually try these reconstructions.
 
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TheNextFeliks

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Hey, could Brest make a reconstruction tutorial to show how to do it? Then we can do it ourselves.

Anyway, this is very true and I am guilty of asking things (such as Maskow's 35/35) that are pointless and too ridiculous.
 

Tim Major

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Hey, could Brest make a reconstruction tutorial to show how to do it? Then we can do it ourselves.

Anyway, this is very true and I am guilty of asking things (such as Maskow's 35/35) that are pointless and too ridiculous.
I'm not Brest, but if they're using a method I know (for example, CFOP for 3x3), I download the video, slow it down, use the scramble on my cube, see what colour cross they do+it's start. I then try to build a cross and see if I end with the same F2L. Then see which pair they do first, I do the pair and see, etc. I find it very easy to reconstruct my own solves, and slightly more difficult when reconstructing other people's solves as they do some different things. If there is a good camera angle and frame rate, I can reconstruct without having any idea what they're doing just by slowing it down.
 

Mollerz

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Pretty much every reconstruction I see, I have to go through it myself until I get it correct. Kind of a habit, but I'm nearly guaranteed to learn something from it. I don't really go through BLD reconstructions because I don't really do BLD right now and it doesn't help me in any way. Nobody should be asking for reconstructions from anyone. If you want them for a particular set of solves reconstructed, do them yourself.
 
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Brest's effort is never wasted. I agree that maybe many people don't use them and simply praise well Brest can put together a reconstruction, but I personally will look at as many reconstructions of Faz and Mats and a few others as I can get my hands on.

I went through every single world final reconstruction (2 or 3 times for most of them) as well those on any videos made by people who are faster than me. By doing so I can figure out patterns and techniques that are very popular among fast cubers, pick up on a few subtle tricks I missed in my progression, and determine what tricks are the most beneficial for really fast solvers.

I don't always comment on the reconstructions I study but I agree 100% that we should be discussing the decision to do certain things. It can only work to facilitate the learning process. I certainly hope Brest doesn't feel frustrated or under appreciated; he has helped me and so many other cubers here more than he may know.
 

A Leman

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I like this Topic and I do read through most of the reconstructions that I see.

For example: unless someone has the memory of Maskow, what good does reconstructing a 35/35 MBLD give us?
The individual cubes aren't being done particularly fast if you're interested in 3BLD, and I don't think anyone's even close to being on the level of solving 35 cubes blind for a reconstruction to be useful.
Memory and Cycle execution are rather separate in BLD. I did go through every reconstruction of the 32/32 MBLD because I use the same edge buffer. And they are being done fast. One of the solves had a 19.84 second execution! I was mostly comparing the cycles but I realized that he used Different cycles for the same cases sometimes which is an interesting find. I also liked D x R2 U' L U R2 U' L' U x' D' and D R U R' U' L2' U R U' R' L2' D'. There is more to learn from speedsolve reconstructions though since there are more tricks.

What I would like to know is how Brest gets the time splits for stages to the hundredth of a second. I have actually done some reconstructions for myself, but I don't post them because they are only the moves so they don't meet the Brest standard.
 

Logiqx

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I find the reconstructions of top solvers really useful. They give me ideas for my own solves and it's great to gain an insight into the approach(es) used by top cubers as well as seeing their algorithms.

Discussions could be useful because there are times when I wonder why a particular decision was made during the solve. Other times it is more a question of how far ahead they could see and whether it affected their choice of solution.

Would it make sense to have a forum for reconstructions and the resulting discussions? People could use the threads to say what they had personally learnt from the reconstruction (perhaps helping others as well) or to ask questions about the solves.
 

cmhardw

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I have seen the comments for Brest to reconstruct really crazy attempts, and to me they often come across as just wanting to see if Brest could/would do it. I do look at the reconstructions, but I'll confess that I don't often do them with cube in hand. I try to see how non-rotation friendly the top cubers are when they solve F2L pairs, and I really like to read the statistics.

Hey, could Brest make a reconstruction tutorial to show how to do it? Then we can do it ourselves.
i have the feeling that people often want reconstructions just for the statistics.
I don't know how Brest would feel about this, but perhaps someone could make up a template for others to do reconstructions up to the "Brest standard". We already know how he does them, but having a blank template stored somewhere that people can just paste in their values into easily might encourage a small number of other dedicated reconstructors to help Brest out.

I use them for entertainment.
What does that mean? Can you please clarify?
 
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