# [Help Thread]Finger Tricks Discussion and Help

#### tsmosher

##### Member
I struggled with this exact same thing for a while. Keep at it and you will build up the muscle and memory to execute M no problem. Before you know it, you'll be doing M U2 M' like it's no big thing.

#### Brouxt Force

##### Member
Also, if you do a right handed U perm, then that means you do the M moves and M2 flicks with you left hand. For example of Ub, which algorithm I use is M2 U M U2 M' U M2, you start with a M2 flick with your left hand using ring and middle fingers, U with right index, left middle finger pushes back of M layer upwards for M, U2 flick with right hand, M' with middle finger push in the back downwards, U with right index finger, M2 flick with right hand.
I use my right hand to do all M slice moves and my left hand to do all U moves for MU gen algs and for LSE.

#### LukasCubes

##### Member
Does anyone else find the M move hard to do fast? I am right handed and I have watched the finger trick video. I have tried using the ring finger (hopeless), and the forefinger (OK but awkward and it takes time for the finger to recover for the next time, esp when it has to do a U). I ended up using the thumb, which is also OK but slow as the grip changes too much. Just now, I thought of doing this, using M'3 instead of M, using in turn the pinkie, ring and middle finger. It's also slow but seems OK, and I like the flow when doing it, i.e not as jerky as when I have to do an M, using whichever finger. What do you think? For example, for U-PERM, I can do

M'2 U' M'3 U'2 M' U' M'2

Using M'3 for U-Perm A is a little less satisfactory, as the right hand is used for all the turns until the M'3. Any advice? Are there alternatives ways of doing these U-Perms, hopefully they also have M' turns, which is fun to do.
M2' U' M U2 M' U' M2' is the better alg, saves some time, more time if your cube turns better.

#### qwr

##### Member
as suggested you can try the RU U perms but I suggest practicing M moves more

#### Cubing Forever

##### Member
you can either use r' R or l L' for M moves.
Either one will work.
umm....but that's slow.

Does anyone else find the M move hard to do fast? I am right handed and I have watched the finger trick video. I have tried using the ring finger (hopeless), and the forefinger (OK but awkward and it takes time for the finger to recover for the next time, esp when it has to do a U). I ended up using the thumb, which is also OK but slow as the grip changes too much. Just now, I thought of doing this, using M'3 instead of M, using in turn the pinkie, ring and middle finger. It's also slow but seems OK, and I like the flow when doing it, i.e not as jerky as when I have to do an M, using whichever finger. What do you think? For example, for U-PERM, I can do

M'2 U' M'3 U'2 M' U' M'2

Using M'3 for U-Perm A is a little less satisfactory, as the right hand is used for all the turns until the M'3. Any advice? Are there alternatives ways of doing these U-Perms, hopefully they also have M' turns, which is fun to do.
You should try to do M moves by pushing the DB edge using your ring finger. It's hard at first but believe me, it'll get easier.
The best way to implement a fingertrick into your solves is to just brute-force it into your solves.

#### Dan the Beginner

as suggested you can try the RU U perms but I suggest practicing M moves more
Yes, I really like twirling the middle layer and watch how it finishes a solve . (That's why I designed my customised Beginner method so that the solve always ends with the a U-Perm, H-Perm or Z-Perm.) I must drill these 2 U-Perm algorithms with M-moves, but it is quite hard for me, to use the ring finger to push back. This is going to take some time. Point taken and thanks for everyone's advice. The other two algorithms that I use often, the Z-Perm and H-Perm, are not a problem. They gave me my highest TPS.

#### Dan the Beginner

umm....but that's slow.

You should try to do M moves by pushing the DB edge using your ring finger. It's hard at first but believe me, it'll get easier.
The best way to implement a fingertrick into your solves is to just brute-force it into your solves.
Thanks, I will be training that ring finger from now on.

#### tsmosher

##### Member
Thanks, I will be training that ring finger from now on.
For what it's worth, Im pretty sure I use my middle finger. Perhaps not as effective, but it works for me.

#### Dan the Beginner

For what it's worth, Im pretty sure I use my middle finger. Perhaps not as effective, but it works for me.
I am confused. Please explain. I normally use my left middle finger (and the thumb) to hold the cube, so that the forefinger is free to do U' with these M algorithms (which have mostly U', U, M and M'). I can use the left ring finger to push the middle layer from underneth to do the M, though it will take a lot of practise. This is what JPerm in his fingertrick video teaches. If however I do as you suggested, using the middle finger, it seems very hard to adjust my left hand grip (you mean using the thumb and forefinger to hold the cube??).

(For the M', I have no problem. The more dextrous and stronger right hand will be pushed slightly forward towards the back of the cube and lower to make it easy to do the many M' or M'2s using the little and ring finger. This is when and why a strong grip using the left middle finger is necessary. I find using the weaker ring finger hard for the left hand grip, and I though that ring finger should be free for D moves, no?)

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#### tsmosher

##### Member
I use my right hand for all M moves. My left hand for all U moves. So, the right middle finger presses the DB edge up from below (with your finger pressing from the D layer upward).

M U2 M' would be (for me): right middle finger presses DB edge up 1/4 turn ending at the back of the top of the cube (M), left index and middle fingers do a double flick of U' (U2), right ring finger (or middle finger) grabs the new DB edge from the back and pulls it toward me 1/4 turn ending at the bottom of the front of the cube (M').

#### Dan the Beginner

I use my right hand for all M moves. My left hand for all U moves. So, the right middle finger presses the DB edge up from below (with your finger pressing from the D layer upward).

M U2 M' would be (for me): right middle finger presses DB edge up 1/4 turn ending at the back top of the cube (M), left index and middle fingers do a double flick of U' (U2), right ring finger (or middle finger) grabs the DB edge from the back and pulls it toward me 1/4 turn (M').
Ah, I see! You meant the right middle finger. Thanks. There are so many ways of doing this. I think you mean you also use your left forefinger to do a U, with a back flick. If so, that is too advanced for me. I tried that but I think it will have to wait until I can get more basic fingertricks down first..

#### CubeRed

##### Member
I am confused. Please explain. I normally use my left middle finger (and the thumb) to hold the cube, so that the forefinger is free to do U' with these M algorithms (which have mostly U', U, M and M'). I can use the left ring finger to push the middle layer from underneth to do the M, though it will take a lot of practise. This is what JPerm in his fingertrick video teaches. If however I do as you suggested, using the middle finger, it seems very hard to adjust my left hand grip (you mean using the thumb and forefinger to hold the cube??).

(For the M', I have no problem. The more dextrous and stronger right hand will be pushed slightly forward towards the back of the cube and lower to make it easy to do the many M' or M'2s using the little and ring finger. This is when and why a strong grip using the left middle finger is necessary. I find using the weaker ring finger hard for the left hand grip, and I though that ring finger should be free for D moves, no?)
I think he means to use the right hand middle finger to do the M gen moves. Although it is fine to use ring and pinky for M gen moves, it will take off some strain to use ring and middle for M2s. It will also help M moves in algs. (Such as the U perm you mentioned. ) If you think ring and pinky is better then ring and middle you can still use it. Experiment and decide.

#### Dan the Beginner

I think he means to use the right hand middle finger to do the M gen moves. Although it is fine to use ring and pinky for M gen moves, it will take off some strain to use ring and middle for M2s. It will also help M moves in algs. (Such as the U perm you mentioned. ) If you think ring and pinky is better then ring and middle you can still use it. Experiment and decide.
Lots of experimentation. Thanks.

#### qwr

##### Member
I use left hand for M and M' moves and right hand for U and U' flick/push. The alternating hands I think makes the algs more ergonomic.