# Practicing Old Pochmann/M2

Discussion in 'Blindsolving Discussion' started by foolish, Mar 2, 2012.

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1. ### foolishMember

65
0
Mar 1, 2012
Munich, Germany
So, I've been checking out tutorials and started practicing Old Pochmann/M2 within the last days and still got some questions.

1) Most tutorials give lots of tips and ideas on practicing the memorization, but apart from the algorithms I haven't read much about the execution. So I wondered, should I directly start memorizing the cube and try to solve (parts of) it blind or would it help to train the method with eyes open first until it can be done pretty fast without too much thinking?

2) I've learnt most of the stuff from Eric Limeback's tutorial on youtube so far and he solves the corners first, then the edges. When checking Stefan's site, I saw that he solves edges first. Is there any advantage in doing either of them first, or just personal preference?

3) I also find it not too easy to do/undo some setup moves intuitively, although they're pretty short. Is learning them by heart for each case an option or should I just keep practicing until I can make them up on the run?

Thanks

2. ### thatkidMember

135
0
Feb 23, 2011
Sydney, Australia mate
WCA:
2012SEET01
1) I personally find it easier to practise parts of it blind rather than doing sighted (eyes open) solving.
2) Eric Limeback solves corners first because of his memo system. It involves tapping and memorising colours. This can not be stored for a very long time so when he does corners first, he still remembers the edges because he has a stronger memo system for them
3) Keep practising. This is the only step that i recommend learning sighted. Just remember to keep set up moves 3 moves long for edges and 1-2 moves long for corners

3. ### AbstractAlgMember

373
0
Oct 30, 2011
WCA:
2012OKAN02
AbstractAlgorithm
1) Practice both ways, sighted for speed, full bld mostly for memo.

2) Tapping+sound gives you fast memo, but short-term. So I would recommend memo edges, memo corners, solve corners, solve edges. Also, I think it's easier to fix parity with corners first.

3) Keep practicing x2, understand why certain setups are the way they are and they will become very natural.

4. ### sukesh12Member

41
0
Oct 4, 2011
Proxima Centauri
WCA:
2011SUBA02
Sukesh Subaharan
I had the same doubts as 'foolish' and I got the answers from 'thatkid'

5. ### thatkidMember

135
0
Feb 23, 2011
Sydney, Australia mate
WCA:
2012SEET01
Lol its actually easier if you do edges first because you don't need the R perm after edges
just do U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U
then solve corners

6. ### RpottsMember

Mar 23, 2008
KC
WCA:
2010POTT01
rpotts1
You don't need R perm to solve parity regardless of whether you solve corners first or edges first. I've never done an R perm in BLD and have only used M2/OP with corners first.

7. ### thatkidMember

135
0
Feb 23, 2011
Sydney, Australia mate
WCA:
2012SEET01
Oh really? I've always done parity with an R perm

8. ### CubenoviceForever Slow

Ehm... isn't R-perm for parity in full Old Pochmann?
This is about M2 edges and there you do not need R-perm

Last edited: Mar 7, 2012
9. ### thatkidMember

135
0
Feb 23, 2011
Sydney, Australia mate
WCA:
2012SEET01
hmmm
that means ive been doing a useless R perm for about a year

Oct 31, 2010
Melbourne, AUS
WCA:
2011KILB01
You're not alone - I did the same thing for a long time, and I still sometimes fall back into old habits without realising.

11. ### CubenoviceForever Slow

If it works for you it is not useless

Please tell us how exacly you use the R-perm with M2
-order of solving?
- set up for R-perm
etc

just trying to understand

12. ### foolishMember

65
0
Mar 1, 2012
Munich, Germany
Eric Limeback teaches: solve corners, R-Perm if odd number of corners, solve edges with M2. Anyway what would you recommend for solving parity with M2, or just memorize the switched edges?

Oct 31, 2010
Melbourne, AUS
WCA:
2011KILB01
Dunno if he does the same as me, but I did:

Solve corners
R-Perm
Solve edges
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U
R-Perm

What I do now:

Solve corners except for the last target
Solve edges
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U
Solve last corner

14. ### CubenoviceForever Slow

Two options copied from Zane_C's awesome M2 + progression thread:

-If you solve corners first:
Leave UBL and UBR swapped. Then once you've finished the edges, apply: M2 y L2 (T-perm) L2

-If you solve edges first:
Once you've solved all the edges, apply: D' L2 D M2 D' L2 D.
Then solve an odd number of corners with Classic Pochmann.

15. ### RpottsMember

Mar 23, 2008
KC
WCA:
2010POTT01
rpotts1
When I have parity I do:

Solve corners
U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U
Solve edges

All this means is you start with the M slice off by an M2.

16. ### AbstractAlgMember

373
0
Oct 30, 2011
WCA:
2012OKAN02
AbstractAlgorithm
Instead of U' F2 U M2 U' F2 U, try

D' L2 D M2 D' L2 D, I find it much more finger-friendly.

17. ### jeffjcMember

6
0
Dec 7, 2011
I do edges first.
If there's parity, I do M2, shoot to UL, M2.

This topic has been completely derailed.

Solve corners
J Perm
Solve edges
M2 y L2 (t perm) L2

19. ### jlaMember

326
0
Aug 31, 2010
Gothenburg, Sweden
WCA:
2011LANG01
jla477
This is exactly what I do

20. ### geocineMember

35
0
Aug 27, 2010
WCA:
2008MONC01
Do you do J Perm and M2 y L2 (t perm) L2 ONLY When there is parity?