# 3-cycle speed optimal blindfold method?

Discussion in 'Blindsolving Discussion' started by yash, Feb 14, 2012.

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1. ### yashMember

3
0
Feb 11, 2012
India
WCA:
2011PULI01
anyone care to explain '3-cycle speed optimal blindfold method'?
i have searched over the internet but couldn't find
currently i am using M2 for Edges and Old-Pochmann for corners.. and i avg around 1:50...

2. ### aronpmMember

Sep 9, 2009
The short name for speed optimal 3-cycles is 3style. Basically, it is a variation of BH. Instead of using move-optimal commutators, it uses speed-optimal commutators. As an example, the BH solution to UBR->DLF->RBD is y R U L2 U' R' U L2 U' y' (8 moves), and the speed-optimal solution is R' U R' D R U' R' D' R2 (9 moves).

Another example is the cyclic shift cases. The optimal (BH) solution is something like R' F U2 F' R F R' U2 R F', and the 3style solution is something like x' U2 R' U2 R' D R U2 R' D' R2 U2 x.

Aug 12, 2010
Aberdeen, Scotland
Godmil
Is there any extensive collection of 3Style algs?

4. ### aronpmMember

Sep 9, 2009
I'm not sure what is available for corners; I know several people have Anki decks with full corner lists but I don't know if any have been properly published.

As for edges, Riffz DF edges. This is mostly what I use. I have exported mine from an Anki deck but because it's a personal deck it's not ready for release (you need to decode my letter scheme, and I want to do a major overhaul. Same with corners (UBR), but I don't even have an exported list)

There's also an UF buffer list somewhere that Zane learned from, but I don't remember where it is.

5. ### EscherBabby

3,351
26
Jul 23, 2008
WCA:
2008KINN01
RowanKinneavy
http://skarrie.se/edges/

Aug 12, 2010
Aberdeen, Scotland
Godmil
Cool thanks, that's a nice collection of algs... so how long did it take you to memorise those? Could be fun to learn, but I'm wondering if I'm not dedicated to practicing it every day if it will be impossible to keep them all memorised.

May 16, 2010
Whiteford, MD, USA
WCA:
2010REES01
RyanReese09
I have all my corner algs in Anki so it's just a mater of publishing it. They are denoted by letter pairs using my scheme

My edge algs I have it denoted by my letter pairs too, although it's on hard paper...

I'm currently in the process of converting it to computer

Aug 12, 2010
Aberdeen, Scotland
Godmil
Does it make sense to memorise each alg along with the letter pair image, or would that just confuse matters?

May 16, 2010
Whiteford, MD, USA
WCA:
2010REES01
RyanReese09
Just confuses it. Don't memorize it via algs. I found it extremely useful to just go case by case and see how each case is and then I remember logically how to solve the case. It took a month to go over all the cases (I'm busy) but it really stuck with me.

10. ### aronpmMember

Sep 9, 2009
They're all intuitive, and if you made up the list yourself it's pretty easy, so not long at all. I don't know how long it would take to learn if you just looked at a list.

Memorising it with the letter pair or the letter pair image is fine. If you memorise with the letter pair image it allows you to have a faster memo recall->alg exec, because you're skipping the step where you decode the letter pair image into its letter pair. However, like most things, both methods converge over time. I personally have the letter pairs in my list but I have full association of word/image with alg now. (on a semi-related-but-unrelated note I basically have an association between two sticker locations and a word/sound/image, if that makes sense... I don't think of letters at all any more except for parity)

edit: with regards to what Ryan said, it's not so much memorising an alg as memorising how you'll rotate the cube and then "oh yeah do some RUD/RUL/LUD/etc comm that I already know and it gets solved".

Aug 12, 2010
Aberdeen, Scotland
Godmil
Cool,
Thanks for the tips.
I'd previously put off the idea of learning something like this cause it seemed way more complex than ZB, but now I look at it, it seems much easier to understand, and also mirror and inverses are pretty easy... I've got about 16 cases down already

May 16, 2010
Whiteford, MD, USA
WCA:
2010REES01
RyanReese09
Yeah a big thing for me was making the list. I found after I went through each case and found a good "alg" for it, I found that upon review, I remembered almost every single one. I was like, oh yeah I remember this case, I originally had "x" but that wasn't so fast and I found "y" instead! Ha! Worked.

Onto next one.

A simple thing to start is looking for cases where you can do one-move setups into an M2 case. For example, I use UB as my buffer. If my cycle is: UB-DL-FR, then I you can do D (U R U' M2 U R' U') M2 D'. There are a lot of cases like so. Hope you find it useful!

14. ### drewsopchakMember

876
0
Apr 22, 2010
Central Upstate New York
WCA:
2010SOPC01
sebucwerd
Are there any 3style corner lists? In your opinions, what are the best buffers? Right now I use UF and UBL.

15. ### Cool FrogMember

Personally I like URB, ULB isn't bad it Just isn't for me. UFR is just as good as URB.
UF isn't a bad you have the option of more RU and MU style speedoptimal algs, But you have to take advantage of that. I personally use FD (LOL orientation) I find that I can visualize the comms better than the RU spam things.

I think Riffz has an alg list for both (ULB and UF). I would say you should make your own list and if you have trouble figuring something fast out you can always hit up aronpm, Riffz, Zane, or me.

16. ### aronpmMember

Sep 9, 2009
Riffz' list is DF. His list is what motivated me to learn 3style edges

UF/DF and UBL/UBR buffers are the most commonly used and therefore have the most documentation. So what you're currently using is fine.

Here's a corner list by riffz.

18. ### MaikeruKonareMember

213
0
Jun 28, 2013
Michigan, USA
WCA:
2013CONA01
SpecialPieMan66
Does anyone have video tutorials on the 3-cycle blindfold method? I use M2 for edges and Old Pochman for corners, and I average 6 minutes.

19. ### ben1996123Banned

May 17, 2009
Ponyville
WCA:
2009WHIT01
ben1996123
3style is the most advanced bld method that people use atm so you shouldnt bother learning it until youre subminute or something. practise

OR, you can not listen to that guy, learn an advanced bld methods while you are slow an get to subminute with that