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Hypocrism

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Yup you sure dont. That is just for practising look ahead and familiarising yourself with how pieces move around cube. Completing 2 f2l pairs is more than enough but trying f2l in one look may help in multislotting in the end. The more familiar you are on how piece move around while inserting a f2l pair, the more you know where a piece is gonna end up after inserting a pair so you can either multislot or you can seamlessly go to solving another f2l pair. In the end it is for the good. There is no harm in trying it ;)
PS: I do f2l in 2 look so it is really not required but helps a lot.

I don't think learning to do the F2L in one look is a useful skill at all, I think doing that would be far less productive than other sorts of training. That trains your ability to predict a long way ahead, sure, but that's not the skill used in a fast f2l, which is primarily the ability to disconnect from the current pair so that you can prepare for future pairs. This ability isn't trained by staring at a cube and trying to memorize moves. Learning the effect one pair has on others is a useful skill, but that's completely different to what this idea would train and there are far better ways of practicing that ability.

Did you learn to solve F2L in one-look? What times did that get you to in speedsolves?
 

Bindedsa

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I don't think learning to do the F2L in one look is a useful skill at all, I think doing that would be far less productive than other sorts of training. That trains your ability to predict a long way ahead, sure, but that's not the skill used in a fast f2l, which is primarily the ability to disconnect from the current pair so that you can prepare for future pairs. This ability isn't trained by staring at a cube and trying to memorize moves. Learning the effect one pair has on others is a useful skill, but that's completely different to what this idea would train and there are far better ways of practicing that ability.

Did you learn to solve F2L in one-look? What times did that get you to in speedsolves?

I did not do any of the stuff CriticalCubing Talked about and average about 13 seconds. It's more realistic and easier to track pieces as your solving one. So while you are not focused on your current pair you are not trying to figure out exactly how to insert the next pair just where the pieces are, this also gives you more room to track more than one pair and avoid bad cases.
 

Hypocrism

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I did not do any of the stuff CriticalCubing Talked about and average about 13 seconds. It's more realistic and easier to track pieces as your solving one. So while you are not focused on your current pair you are not trying to figure out exactly how to insert the next pair just where the pieces are, this also gives you more room to track more than one pair and avoid bad cases.

Agreed. I have similar times but doing more than two pairs BLD doesn't seem useful in speedsolves to me. Tracking is a much more useful skill than predicting 2 slots in advance, and the most useful skill for me at the moment is gradually picking up knowledge of how one case morphs into another when it's upset by a QTM during the prior pair, because then I know exactly what case comes next for that pair.
 

Hypocrism

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Is there a way to put in more than one f2l pair at a time.??

There are multislotting techniques, a lot of which involve inserting an L/L' move before your regular insert (which can be done intuitively, often) or using D moves, which generally isn't intuitive.

Multislotting isn't mainstream, what is much more widely used is pair selection (choosing an F2L pair whose insertion sets up a nice case for your next pair), tracking & prediction, as well as edge control.

It certainly isn't worth looking into multislotting until you're well in the top solvers in the world, certainly not something for most of us!
 

TDM

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There are multislotting techniques, a lot of which involve inserting an L/L' move before your regular insert (which can be done intuitively, often) or using D moves, which generally isn't intuitive.
I disagree that D moves during F2L aren't intuitive; it's just edge keyhole and corner keyhole at the same time.
It certainly isn't worth looking into multislotting until you're well in the top solvers in the world, certainly not something for most of us!
I think that it's like being colour neutral: sure, you can learn it when you're fast and it'll help, but if you learn it early on it will still improve your times and you'll find it much more easy to get used to than if you have to stop doing what you've practised so much at a later stage. I think that if you want to learn it then do, however fast you are, but it's not absolutely necessary for fast times.
 

Hypocrism

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I disagree that D moves during F2L aren't intuitive; it's just edge keyhole and corner keyhole at the same time.

I think it takes more than intuition to work out which orientation of the edge you need on the fly, since generally we recognise cases by matching/non-matching colours, not by consciously taking into account what orientation the edge is in. But I agree that it can be rapid once you've got over that difficulty.

I think that it's like being colour neutral: sure, you can learn it when you're fast and it'll help, but if you learn it early on it will still improve your times and you'll find it much more easy to get used to than if you have to stop doing what you've practised so much at a later stage. I think that if you want to learn it then do, however fast you are, but it's not absolutely necessary for fast times.

I don't agree with this, because at slower speeds it's better to focus on tracking and reducing pauses than reducing movecount. Trying to multislot will only increase the tendency to stare at a motionless cube, trying to recognise your case, when you should be solving them as two pairs without a pause until you're very advanced.

To clarify, by multislotting I'm not referring just to inserts using D moves, but the system as a whole. Learning to use D moves for more than one slot at a time might be useful, but cases where most pieces are in the top layer won't be as useful.
 

TDM

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I think it takes more than intuition to work out which orientation of the edge you need on the fly, since generally we recognise cases by matching/non-matching colours, not by consciously taking into account what orientation the edge is in. But I agree that it can be rapid once you've got over that difficulty.
I guess that because I first solved a cube with keyhole, it is probably easier for me than for most people... I never used beginner's F2L until I was fast enough with CFOP to be sub-25 with LBL. You're probably right.
I don't agree with this, because at slower speeds it's better to focus on tracking and reducing pauses than reducing movecount. Trying to multislot will only increase the tendency to stare at a motionless cube, trying to recognise your case, when you should be solving them as two pairs without a pause until you're very advanced.
Isn't this the case with colour neutrality though? If you start being colour neutral, lookahead is always harder at first and there'll be a lot of pauses.
To clarify, by multislotting I'm not referring just to inserts using D moves, but the system as a whole. Learning to use D moves for more than one slot at a time might be useful, but cases where most pieces are in the top layer won't be as useful.
I know, I was too. I think that it's like CFOP users learning COLL or WV: it won't be useful a lot of the time, but it can be very helpful in some solves.
 

Twoflower

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I am stucked with average of 26 seconds in a 3x3x3 cube.... I use Friedrich Method.... What should I do now to improve my average time?? :(

Practise less and don't spend time reading the answers others got, when they asked the exact same question.

Oh, and I almost forgot: Read the first post in this thread, please!
 
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alevine

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Refreshing memory on how I actually do this?

I haven't cubed for way too long. I knew full PLL, and was able to solve a cube with sub-30 times. Now I'm trying to get back into it, but I haven't done it in a while, and I've forgotten most of my algorithms... even 2-look. F2L I still know. Now I'm slightly over 40 seconds (whoa!), and can't seem to be able to learn algs the way I used to. Is there some way to get me back to where I was, but without totally re-learning the full PLL and everything? That took me months :p Even my WCA profile looks waaaaaaaay better than my times do now. Sometimes I can't even solve it.
 
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cubemenot

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Stuck at Sub-20. HELP!

Hi,

I'm been speed cubing for a long time now and I have been improving but after I got to sub-20 2 months ago, I can't get lower times. I'm stuck at 20 seconds. Can anyone give me help. I know 2-look OLL and many OLL algs and full PLL. Any tips would help me and other. Thanks! :)
 

Artic

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Welcome to my world. Getting past the 20 second barrier seems to be the toughest for most people to beat...including myself :( Just keep practicing, learning new algorithms, and never give up! Remember, hard work does pay off, and if you keep fighting for something....eventually you'll get it.
 
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Hi,

I'm been speed cubing for a long time now and I have been improving but after I got to sub-20 2 months ago, I can't get lower times. I'm stuck at 20 seconds. Can anyone give me help. I know 2-look OLL and many OLL algs and full PLL. Any tips would help me and other. Thanks! :)

Learn full OLL. Never stop learning stuff.

I was stuck in the 20 seconds for a long time, then I learned full OLL and broke the barrier.

Now I'm on the 16 seconds trying to break the 15 seconds barrier, learning COLL. :D
 
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xsolver

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New solver, what to learn further? [3x3]

Hello SS forums!

I've been cubing for the past month or so and i've seen some nice progressions. In the first 3 days of my cubing journey, i learned the beginner method. But ofcourse, that was not challenging at all so in my fourth day i started learning intuitive F2L. I got the basics, learned a few tricks and alg's for some heavy cases and i moved on forward to 2L OLL/PLL. I got 2L OLL and PLL done in 2 days. So actually in my first week of cubing, i learned the beginner method, F2L, 2look OLL, 2look PLL. It may not be something to bow to, but it was a nice achievment for me, especially because i had no previous experience with cubing before.

After i learned all that, i decided that it was time to stop learning new things and exercise with what i've got. It's been probably 3 weeks since i started cubing, and the last 2 weeks were only exercising. 2 days ago i got my first sub35 solve and i was really happy. My avg is around 45s, maybe even 40 if i get a good recognition. Have in mind that the cube i got is REAAALLLYY bad, it's from an unknown distribution that doesnt even have a name, there is no corner cutting, reverse cutting, or anything like that. I ordered an ChiLong 2 weeks ago, now im waiting for it to be delivered.

My question is, what should i learn further? Should i just wait for my cube to come? Or should i learn something like full PLL before? I need some tips and suggestions on what to work with.

Thank you in advance!
 

DeeDubb

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My question is, what should i learn further? Should i just wait for my cube to come? Or should i learn something like full PLL before? I need some tips and suggestions on what to work with.

Thank you in advance!

Just keep practicing. I started adding advanced algorithms at about your speed, but it's important to bring them in slowly, so you have time to incorporate them into your muscle memory and work on recognition. Of course, learn full PLL before worrying about OLL. I think F2L is the most important part of getting faster though, so keep working on that.

Maybe work on some slow solves, especially since you aren't using a good cube. This will help you become a more efficient solver by giving yourself time to find the best method. It's good to split your time down the middle between timed solves and untimed slow solves.
 
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